2024 Republican Primary

[Dirty]

I'm pretty interested in the R primaries. The debates should be crazy and entertaining if nothing else. The general predicament of every R candidate now being forced to kiss Trump's nuts constantly or else lose his entire fan base and thus lose any chance of winning anything is sad yet amusing.

Seems like Vivek has gained a lot of steam in recent weeks. The first clip I saw of him I kinda liked him, but the more clips I saw over time, the more I realized he's just a different flavor of the same dogshit. I do feel like Trump would consider him as a running mate tho.

[DJChameleon]

I'm pretty interested in the R primaries. The debates should be crazy and entertaining if nothing else. The general predicament of every R candidate now being forced to kiss Trump's nuts constantly or else lose his entire fan base and thus lose any chance of winning anything is sad yet amusing.

Seems like Vivek has gained a lot of steam in recent weeks. The first clip I saw of him I kinda liked him, but the more clips I saw over time, the more I realized he's just a different flavor of the same dogshit. I do feel like Trump would consider him as a running mate tho.

Sup Dirty long time no see. How are the kids?

Yeah I'm in the debates for the circus of it all. Should be entertaining but the whole field sucks. You need to be able to challenge Trump and differeniate from him regardless of losing his base. Trump fans are so blinded by thier love for Trump that they even say they aren't Republican.

I saw one on Twitter say I'm a Trump supporter not a Republican.

[Dirty]

Sup Dirty long time no see. How are the kids?

Yeah I'm in the debates for the circus of it all. Should be entertaining but the whole field sucks. You need to be able to challenge Trump and differeniate from him regardless of losing his base. Trump fans are so blinded by thier love for Trump that they even say they aren't Republican.

I saw one on Twitter say I'm a Trump supporter not a Republican.

Hey DJ, only got one but she's great. Life is good and i hope you're doing well.

What a group of characters. I really don't see any way someone can win the nom without capturing the Trump base. It's a high wire act that I don't think anyone is gonna be able to solve. Now that they all know how Trump operates, im excited to see the mud slinging that these debates will bring. Lots of loud interruptions to show everyone who's most alpha lmao

[Jwb]

Honestly Christie vs Trump is gearing up o be the only part of the republican debates I'm interested in so far. DeSantis is such a cowering pussy in the shadow of trump that it's shameful.

[SGR]

Honestly Christie vs Trump is gearing up o be the only part of the republican debates I'm interested in so far. DeSantis is such a cowering pussy in the shadow of trump that it's shameful.

DeSantis is the Trump tribute band.

Regarding Christie, Trump will deliver a few well timed fat jokes, the crowd will laugh at him, and no one will remember what Christie said in response.

That's assuming Trump shows up for the debates of course. If he does, the person he should be worried about is Vivek. He's probably the only guy I'd think who could outmaneuver Trump in a debate.

[Nimbly9]

I'd take Vivek over Biden in a heartbeat tbh. He's way smarter compared to the vast majority of clowns who have run for the office in the last couple of decades.

[Lexi Darling]

I'd take Vivek over Biden in a heartbeat tbh. He's way smarter compared to the vast majority of clowns who have run for the office in the last couple of decades.

Too bad he's not smart enough to not be a transphobe.

I'd take Biden over someone who parrots the same anti-LGBT, anti-"woke" slander toward my people as all the other Republican bullies.

[Nimbly9]

Too bad he's not smart enough to not be a transphobe.

I'd take Biden over someone who parrots the same anti-LGBT, anti-"woke" slander toward my people as all the other Republican bullies.

Well the good news for you is you can go out and vote based on whatever perception you have on any issue under the sun in 2024.  Biden has a good chance of getting re-elected if he wins the same kinds of numbers he did before.

That being said, my take is that there isn't very much of a macro-level difference in what either political party actually does as far as LGBTQ issues go, especially considering overall global political trends.  Despite what they say during Pride Month, Democrats here in the U.S. are out of step with their more liberal equivalents in the Nordic countries anyway, and China and the MIddle East and other places aren't going to change their stripes on the issue either because you can't change someone's view on what men or women are through legislation.  There's no governing body or political ideology on the planet that is going to convince conservative Muslims or Protestants or whoever else that X is Y and vice versa.

A more likely scenario based on the trends I've been observing is an eventual national divorce of sorts where laws related to LGBTQ-related issues of all kinds will simply be left up to the states (red and blue) and people will just have to move where they feel most at home culturally, socioeconomically, etc. since the federal government will be unable to make real progress in changing the minds of large portions of the voting electorate.  This scenario is already happening in the present, though we are in the very earliest stage of it.

[Lexi Darling]

I would just like to say that saying there's "not much difference" between the two American parties regarding what they will do for LGBT issues is an utterly ludicrous statement, with all due respect.

And it's all well and good to say "just move" like all the trans people who are unfortunate enough to live in red states have the means to just pack up and make a mass pilgrimage to blue states. And at least two front running republicans have said they seek to ban trans healthcare nationwide for all ages.. This is not an issue you can just handwave away like that, sorry.

My original point of posting here was to say that this is something we probably will have to agree to disagree on, as you yourself said. I don't want to debate anymore. It was a mistake to even click on this thread. I'll try to be better about that.

[Nimbly9]

I understand. My fault honestly, I should know what to expect when I click on a thread about republicans. I'll excuse myself.

Fair enough. I don't know of any Republican candidates that aren't, at a bare minimum, extremely skeptical of the benefits of gender affirming care.  That DeSantis ad that got all the blowback, where he supposedly showcased how Trump was supposedly most "pro-LGBTQ" Republican in history is pretty whack.

[Nimbly9]

I would just like to say that saying there's "not much difference" between the two American parties regarding what they will do for LGBT issues is an utterly ludicrous statement, with all due respect.

And it's all well and good to say "just move" like all the trans people who are unfortunate enough to live in red states have the means to just pack up and make a mass pilgrimage to blue states. And at least two front running republicans have said they seek to ban trans healthcare nationwide for all ages.. This is not an issue you can just handwave away like that, sorry.

My original point of posting here was to say that this is something we probably will have to agree to disagree on, as you yourself said. I don't want to debate anymore. It was a mistake to even click on this thread. I'll try to be better about that.

1. There really isn't any meaningful difference, because no matter what policy they say they want to push it isn't going to change minds on gender affirming care with significant chunks of the voting electorate across multiple demographics. This cuts both ways FYI - people who think gender affirming care is gospel aren't going to change their minds either. 

I've watched it play out and I study a wide range of trends both domestic and abroad (such as what has happened with the Norwegian Healthcare Investigation Board)  - I'm not convinced the Democratic Party is going to do anything meaningful about it in light of those prevailing international forces in government and healthcare that disagree with the APA.

2. First off, lawmakers and politicians say all kinds of things in both parties at all levels of government - they are in the business of over promising and under delivering no matter what audience they are catering to.  Lawmakers in Connecticut recently, for instance, pushed to essentially criminalize "hate speech" against MAPs - that hasn't worked out so well.  Also recently some MAGA Republican-types talked at one point about impeaching BIden over some nonsense  - also hasn't worked out so well.  Ask yourself what the actual likelihood of gender affirming care getting nationally banned is. 

I would tell anyone to aim to "move" elsewhere if they are unhappy where they are for any reason. Nobody can guarantee outcomes for you, so the best choice if you really hate where you are is to take steps to go somewhere else, even if it is just baby steps.  People have been doing it for thousands of years and they'll be doing it long after I'm dead.  Changing your environment is a million times more feasible than waiting around on lawmakers to do something that'll benefit you directly.

3. I don't disagree with your choices.  I'm just saying I'll vote for the third party or a "radical" who talks about how he'd dismantle the FBI and IRS and reduce the size of government.  DeSantis isn't that guy so I wouldn't vote for him. But Biden is most likely going to win re-election so it doesn't really matter what I think about it anyway.

[DJChameleon]

1. There really isn't any meaningful difference, because no matter what policy they say they want to push it isn't going to change minds on gender affirming care with significant chunks of the voting electorate across multiple demographics. This cuts both ways FYI - people who think gender affirming care is gospel aren't going to change their minds either. 

I've watched it play out and I study a wide range of trends both domestic and abroad (such as what has happened with the Norwegian Healthcare Investigation Board)  - I'm not convinced the Democratic Party is going to do anything meaningful about it in light of those prevailing international forces in government and healthcare that disagree with the APA.

2. First off, lawmakers and politicians say all kinds of things in both parties at all levels of government - they are in the business of over promising and under delivering no matter what audience they are catering to.  Lawmakers in Connecticut recently, for instance, pushed to essentially criminalize "hate speech" against MAPs - that hasn't worked out so well.  Also recently some MAGA Republican-types talked at one point about impeaching BIden over some nonsense  - also hasn't worked out so well.  Ask yourself what the actual likelihood of gender affirming care getting nationally banned is. 

I would tell anyone to aim to "move" elsewhere if they are unhappy where they are for any reason. Nobody can guarantee outcomes for you, so the best choice if you really hate where you are is to take steps to go somewhere else, even if it is just baby steps.  People have been doing it for thousands of years and they'll be doing it long after I'm dead.  Changing your environment is a million times more feasible than waiting around on lawmakers to do something that'll benefit you directly.

3. I don't disagree with your choices.  I'm just saying I'll vote for the third party or a "radical" who talks about how he'd dismantle the FBI and IRS and reduce the size of government.  DeSantis isn't that guy so I wouldn't vote for him. But Biden is most likely going to win re-election so it doesn't really matter what I think about it anyway.

1. This isn't about changing people's minds. This is a policy discussion. Do you even live in the states? If something concerning trans healthcare gets up to the Supreme Court with the 6-3 balance that is currently leaning conservative. This can actually become a reality and affect every trans person nationwide.  Just look at what they did recently with affirmative action and also over turning Roe V. Wade.

2. Don't take what politicians say lightly they can and do make changes to policies that are harmful to people's lives on the regular.

Also no way in hell is it easier to just pack up your whole life and move. You are speaking from a privileged point of view right now. Most people are struggling to get their basic needs meet and adding moving costs to that is not realistic.

3. Thanks for throwing away your vote by voting third party. I don't agree with corporate democrats on most things but I rather them be in office than the extreme opposition. I vote for progressive liberals locally, state wide and I would nationwide but there hasn't been a strong progressive candidate make it to the federal level yet. I mean the closest person was Bernie.

[Nimbly9]

1.  The federal government isn't going to be able to force people via legislation who disagree with the APA and others about what a woman is, what a man is, etc, which is essentially the root of the culture war. Abortion has also been a contentious issue for decades in its own way, but it doesn't even begin to compare to what is going on currently.  The people who cross certain lines as far as "hate speech" goes tend to get arrested for one thing or another as it is.  If you push those boundaries further (for instance, trying an authoritarian measure that would go after people for not using the right pronouns), the outcome isn't going to be a positive one.  RE: see Bud Light and Target.

Also, I don't think your POV on the Supreme Court dynamics is correct. Look at what happened with Allen v. Milligan.   Roe v Wade is a completely separate point of discussion and I'm not going to get into that with you.


2. Sure they can, but nobody really knows what any of them will do or not do. Trump said he was going to put Hillary Clinton in jail - he didn't even bother trying once he was actually elected.  Political speculation is messy and imprecise, no? Speaking of the latter, look at Biden's own voting record over the years in relation to where he is right now in 2023.  Look at what he said about gay marriage not even 10 years ago. That's why it is pointless to get hung up about politics, because you never know who is telling the truth and who isn't or even if their views will change or not.  You can control what you do and where you go and very little else. 

If people were actually honest about voting for the absolute best possible candidate with all factors and capabilities considered, they'd pick a Vivek or an Andrew Yang or a Bernie Sanders over the Bidens and Trumps of the world.   And yet there are still tons of people who don't even cast a vote at all when they could do it easily.  It's a sad state of affairs.

3. If that's what you think, then perhaps things aren't going to go all that smoothly for Democrats heading into 2024. Is Biden lying about the vast amount of available jobs and opportunities out there? He stumps about it seemingly every week now.


I live in a red state so yeah, I'd be better off voting for a 3rd party.  Biden is either a shoe-in for the disillusioned or a DOA inevitability unless RFK Jr. pulls some kind of upset, so forgive me if I seem like a window shopper at this point.

[Lisnaholic]

1. This isn't about changing people's minds. This is a policy discussion. Do you even live in the states? If something concerning trans healthcare gets up to the Supreme Court with the 6-3 balance that is currently leaning conservative. This can actually become a reality and affect every trans person nationwide.  Just look at what they did recently with affirmative action and also over turning Roe V. Wade.

2. Don't take what politicians say lightly they can and do make changes to policies that are harmful to people's lives on the regular.

Also no way in hell is it easier to just pack up your whole life and move. You are speaking from a privileged point of view right now. Most people are struggling to get their basic needs meet and adding moving costs to that is not realistic.

3. Thanks for throwing away your vote by voting third party. I don't agree with corporate democrats on most things but I rather them be in office than the extreme opposition. I vote for progressive liberals locally, state wide and I would nationwide but there hasn't been a strong progressive candidate make it to the federal level yet. I mean the closest person was Bernie.

^ Excellent post, DJ, which, point by point, I completely agree with.

"I'm just saying I'll vote for the third party or a "radical" who talks about how he'd dismantle the FBI and IRS and reduce the size of government."

^ My response to this is "Careful what you wish for, Nimbly". Do you really want an America that has no protection from Russian spies, terrorist organisations,  hackers of bank accounts, the Mafia, etc ? Also, an America without tax revenue would be what, exactly? An America without schools, hospitals or whatever those tax dollars are spent on ?

[Nimbly9]

The U.S. federal government wastes somewhere north of $247 billion in taxpayer dollars every year.  The IRS focuses most of their time and energy auditing and going after the poorest Americans as opposed to the rich ones. Laws need to be fixed, but these organizations need to be demolished and reformed into leaner and less politicized entities that do their jobs more effectively for everyday Americans, no?

An America that doesn't waste most of my money would be a nice start before I worry about giving them more or less.