Suggestion: New forum for controversial content

[Trollheart]

Can all members please be reminded we will not allow personal attacks, either public or in private (if reported) against another? Please calm the fuck down. Thanks.

[Guybrush]

OH, like I wrote in the ChatGPT thread when I shut it down, sensitive topics should be treated a little more delicately.

My appeal to anyone would be that if you want to discuss something controversial and only have the best intentions as to why, just please make those intentions clear right up top. If you only provide something shocking and a smiley, it's not enough. If people then misunderstand or get an angle to attack, it's likely to cause a mess and it's also likely to derail the conversation you actually wanted to have.

I would like to spend my time here doing something else than put out fires and clean up after the mess that woke and racism discussions leave in an increasing amount of threads. I'm kinda hoping that it's just a phase and when these topics are out of everyone's system, perhaps activity would shift into more benign things like music and movies discussions. I'd like that and am fairly sure Trollheart feels the same.

Either way, we could discuss controversial topics if we just approach them with a bit more care. I'm sure that would significantly reduce the amount of conflict that goes on here.

[Nimbly9]

When it comes to starting uber controversial topic threads that'll make people mad, my body says yes...but my heart says no. 

[Lexi Darling]

OH, like I wrote in the ChatGPT thread when I shut it down, sensitive topics should be treated a little more delicately.

My appeal to anyone would be that if you want to discuss something controversial and only have the best intentions as to why, just please make those intentions clear right up top. If you only provide something shocking and a smiley, it's not enough. If people then misunderstand or get an angle to attack, it's likely to cause a mess and it's also likely to derail the conversation you actually wanted to have.

I would like to spend my time here doing something else than put out fires and clean up after the mess that woke and racism discussions leave in an increasing amount of threads. I'm kinda hoping that it's just a phase and when these topics are out of everyone's system, perhaps activity would shift into more benign things like music and movies discussions. I'd like that and am fairly sure Trollheart feels the same.

Either way, we could discuss controversial topics if we just approach them with a bit more care. I'm sure that would significantly reduce the amount of conflict that goes on here.

I concur. IMO The discussions of politics and social issues are not the problem in and of themselves, but it requires being polite and genuine in our desire to understand others' points of view rather than posting in bad faith.

I struggle with my own impulses to call people out, make no mistake. But at the end of the day I try my best to understand others' viewpoints and not dismiss them, and I implore everyone to do the same. And by the same token, please be genuine. I'm not going to debate someone whose mind is clearly already made up and comes at me with bad faith or inflammatory posts.

I'm not talking about anyone in particular, I'm talking about all of us, myself included. I think we need to work together to make this place a civil discussion forum. Just my take on the whole thing.

[Toy Revolver]

OH, like I wrote in the ChatGPT thread when I shut it down, sensitive topics should be treated a little more delicately.

My appeal to anyone would be that if you want to discuss something controversial and only have the best intentions as to why, just please make those intentions clear right up top. If you only provide something shocking and a smiley, it's not enough. If people then misunderstand or get an angle to attack, it's likely to cause a mess and it's also likely to derail the conversation you actually wanted to have.

I would like to spend my time here doing something else than put out fires and clean up after the mess that woke and racism discussions leave in an increasing amount of threads. I'm kinda hoping that it's just a phase and when these topics are out of everyone's system, perhaps activity would shift into more benign things like music and movies discussions. I'd like that and am fairly sure Trollheart feels the same.

Either way, we could discuss controversial topics if we just approach them with a bit more care. I'm sure that would significantly reduce the amount of conflict that goes on here.

maybe people could use care instead intentionally and disingenuously casting me in the worst possible light and then being rewarded for it because surprise surprise mods are easy to manipulate

[Guybrush]

maybe people could use care instead intentionally and disingenuously casting me in the worst possible light and then being rewarded for it because surprise surprise mods are easy to manipulate

Even I was offended by the first post in the ChatGPT thread and I promise you that doesn't happen often. I had to think about what your intentions could possibly be for posting it and had to read more in order to make sense of it. I was able to do that, but why wouldn't you just make it obvious that it wasn't a racist stab? Are you gonna make me have to work in order to figure out if you're racist or not? Just make it easier, please.

A bull in a china shop will make a mess even if it doesn't intend to. If you can help it, don't make a mess.

[Trollheart]

OH,  you may or may not be unaware of it, but there are people here who actually like you. But you make it hard to do that when you keep posting what seem to be deliberately inflammatory posts that you know people will rise to. If you could just channel your energies elsewhere maybe you wouldn't feel the need to do this. Are we likely to see Lamplighter surface here by any chance? I used to enjoy reading that.

[Janszoon]

OH,  you may or may not be unaware of it, but there are people here who actually like you. But you make it hard to do that when you keep posting what seem to be deliberately inflammatory posts that you know people will rise to. If you could just channel your energies elsewhere maybe you wouldn't feel the need to do this. Are we likely to see Lamplighter surface here by any chance? I used to enjoy reading that.

I used to really enjoy his posts at one time as well. I think he has a great taste in music and usually has interesting things to say about it, but the endless barrage of—to put it as charitably as possible—racially-tinged posts at MB and now here is exhausting.

[Rubber Soul]

OH,  you may or may not be unaware of it, but there are people here who actually like you. But you make it hard to do that when you keep posting what seem to be deliberately inflammatory posts that you know people will rise to. If you could just channel your energies elsewhere maybe you wouldn't feel the need to do this. Are we likely to see Lamplighter surface here by any chance? I used to enjoy reading that.

OH,  you may or may not be unaware of it, but there are people here who actually like you. But you make it hard to do that when you keep posting what seem to be deliberately inflammatory posts that you know people will rise to. If you could just channel your energies elsewhere maybe you wouldn't feel the need to do this. Are we likely to see Lamplighter surface here by any chance? I used to enjoy reading that.

I used to really enjoy his posts at one time as well. I think he has a great taste in music and usually has interesting things to say about it, but the endless barrage of—to put it as charitably as possible—racially-tinged posts at MB and now here is exhausting.

To parrot this, I have to say I learned a lot more about jazz through OH, so, yeah, you have a lot more value than those uber political posts than you can imagine, Dreams.

[jimmy jazz]

Have to remember that hawks are birds of prey so they can be dangerous and attack you. Need to keep this in mind.

[Trollheart]

Hawks are also majestic princes of the air, whose flight and grace can give you much pleasure to watch.
And some of them know a lot about jazz and ambient music.

[Lisnaholic]

My feeling is that for mods and users alike, you should keep things as simple as possible. As we already have a "Secret" section, isn't that a suitable place to put controvertial topics? Either the thread-starter puts their thread there, or a mod relocates a thread that is heating up too much.

On the topic of threads overheating, I think that Dreams's comments about Janszoon are way over-the-top: personal insults, unjustified inferences about the real-life Janszoon, as well as (unfounded) accusations that he is somehow insufficiently active politically. None that is fair imo, and although I don't know the details, I don't imagine that the suggestion that J "ignored" OH is fair either. Isn't this a known assumption that we all make going in: Nobody has any obligation to answer anybody else's post. We all have the freedom to come and go as we please. On the one hand, that makes for very comfortable, no-obligation acquaintanceships, the downside is that I'm sure all of us feel neglected at times, like "Why doesn't anyone respond to me ?" I will confess that bitter tears have been shed on this keyboard as I have waited for replies to some of my own posts, but you should never shame specific people about not responding.

[Toy Revolver]

was it fair to call my post "eugenics adjacent"

i mean how much abuse am i supposed to take

he doesn't like the woke thread so he implies it's right wing propaganda

he doesn't like cis is a slur thread so he calls me transphobic

he doesn't like the chatgpt thread so he associates me with nazis

hell yes i'm going to punch back

and is there would not be any queer liberation with only neoliberal cowards fighting - it would just be a bunch of closet cases

i'm shaming him for being dishonest in his characterizations of me while hiding behind false persona of innocence - even when offered an olive stick

and frankly considering all the things it has been acceptable of accusing me of i should punch much harder

[Toy Revolver]

OH, like I wrote in the ChatGPT thread when I shut it down, sensitive topics should be treated a little more delicately.

My appeal to anyone would be that if you want to discuss something controversial and only have the best intentions as to why, just please make those intentions clear right up top. If you only provide something shocking and a smiley, it's not enough. If people then misunderstand or get an angle to attack, it's likely to cause a mess and it's also likely to derail the conversation you actually wanted to have.

I would like to spend my time here doing something else than put out fires and clean up after the mess that woke and racism discussions leave in an increasing amount of threads. I'm kinda hoping that it's just a phase and when these topics are out of everyone's system, perhaps activity would shift into more benign things like music and movies discussions. I'd like that and am fairly sure Trollheart feels the same.

Either way, we could discuss controversial topics if we just approach them with a bit more care. I'm sure that would significantly reduce the amount of conflict that goes on here.

I concur. IMO The discussions of politics and social issues are not the problem in and of themselves, but it requires being polite and genuine in our desire to understand others' points of view rather than posting in bad faith.

I struggle with my own impulses to call people out, make no mistake. But at the end of the day I try my best to understand others' viewpoints and not dismiss them, and I implore everyone to do the same. And by the same token, please be genuine. I'm not going to debate someone whose mind is clearly already made up and comes at me with bad faith or inflammatory posts.

I'm not talking about anyone in particular, I'm talking about all of us, myself included. I think we need to work together to make this place a civil discussion forum. Just my take on the whole thing.

i say i don't want to be called cis - you're like ok - you don't agree with the slur but you don't call me transphobic either

i doubt you'd answer this but if trans hadn't fought it's way to the the t in lgbt

if trans people were totally not accepted by any part of the media

who do you think would fight for you janz or me?

without any guidance but intuition and this is right this is wrong - who do you really think would have your back?

it's obviously me so i don't even care if you don't want to say it or really even if you pretend to the contrary

[Jwb]

I thought OH's comments on janz were tame. And on point. What was the most offensive one? That he doesn't even like Sun Ra?