Everything Ireland thread

[QuantumSync]

[Trollheart]

WARNING! TRIGGER ALERT: CONTAINS DETAILS OF SEXUAL EXPLOITATION OF CHILDREN. READ AT YOUR OWN RISK!

Faceless Evil: The Man who Destroyed more children's lives than can be counted is an Irishman

A man who targeted teenage girls with a despicable "catfishing" scheme to blackmail them, and whose persecution led to one of them taking her own life, has been jailed for a minimum of 20 years.
20 years minimum prison sentence for McCartney

Harrowing tale of one of the victim's experiences

[QuantumSync]

[QuantumSync]

[FETCHER.]

I recently looked at an old family bible, I didn't realise it was my great-grandparents that moved to the UK. I had always assumed it was a bit further back than that.

I'm going to start saying I am Irish-Scottish 🙂.

[jimmy jazz]

I recently looked at an old family bible, I didn't realise it was my great-grandparents that moved to the UK. I had always assumed it was a bit further back than that.

I'm going to start saying I am Irish-Scottish 🙂.

They reckon about 10% of Brits have recent Irish ancestry, that's a grandparent or parent. I've got two grandparents.

If we go back further it's probably about half of us. Birmingham, Manchester, Liverpool and obviously the West of Scotland have a large Irish diaspora.

It is why I find it a bit strange when people think that 1) we hate each other and 2) we're different, as neither are true in reality.

[FETCHER.]

Oh absolutely, a lot of my friends are the same and there is a ton of Irish surnames bouncing around up here.

If I ever fancy a change I'd love to move to Ireland 😊.

[QuantumSync]

[Trollheart]

I've noted in my History of Ireland journal that in a very real way, the whole sectarian problem that lies at the heart of the division between English and Irish is down to one man wanting to get his end away. If Harry VIII hadn't wanted to get in the pantaloons of Mrs. Boleyn's favourite daughter - or, to be more precise, if she'd been happy to be a mistress and not the queen (which would have saved her own head into the bargain) - the Pope would not have got involved, Henry would never have gone Protestant, and there would be no real basis for the hatred between Irish and English, because essentially, when it comes right down to it, historically, the difference is that one is Catholic and one is Protestant, and each hates the other because they believe them to be heretics. See also under "Reasons to Blame God for the Troubles" and "Another 1000 Reasons Why Religion Sucks."

[QuantumSync]

I've noted in my History of Ireland journal that in a very real way, the whole sectarian problem that lies at the heart of the division between English and Irish is down to one man wanting to get his end away. If Harry VIII hadn't wanted to get in the pantaloons of Mrs. Boleyn's favourite daughter - or, to be more precise, if she'd been happy to be a mistress and not the queen (which would have saved her own head into the bargain) - the Pope would not have got involved, Henry would never have gone Protestant, and there would be no real basis for the hatred between Irish and English, because essentially, when it comes right down to it, historically, the difference is that one is Catholic and one is Protestant, and each hates the other because they believe them to be heretics. See also under "Reasons to Blame God for the Troubles" and "Another 1000 Reasons Why Religion Sucks."

That is really interesting. I'll learn more about Harry VIII

I have been emailing that content creator who did those videos, he has a bunch of great ones.

[Trollheart]

Yup.

From Four Green Fields:

Intermission: Catholic England? The Trouser Serpent Enters Eden

Here I'd like to diverge slightly away from the timeline, and look back to see how things could have been different, for Ireland and for England. What I'll propose here will of course be simplistic and I'm sure there are plenty of valid reasons for the hatreds between our two countries, but it can't be denied that the biggest bone of contention - even when England left a remnant of its eight-hundred-year occupation behind it to stagger through almost into the twenty-first century - between us has been religion.

So, the question becomes: what if England had remained Catholic?

It's not as crazy a question, I think, as it seems. England had been, after all, staunchly Catholic for thousands of years, if only because up to then there was only Catholicism in Christianity. It was the early fifteenth century that saw the rise of Martin  Luther and what would become known as Protestantism, which slowly spread across Europe, but England resisted it, even to the point of its then king, Henry VIII, writing in vigorous defence of Catholicism and denouncing Luther, earning him the title Fidei Defensor, or Defender of the Faith, bestowed upon him by a grateful Pope Leo X. Remember, at this point England was a world power, and the pope would have been concerned had its king turned against him. Of course, later that's exactly what he did (though not specifically against the Pope himself, but against his allies) but that's history and here we're considering an alternate timeline.

Henry's problem with Catholicism - or more properly, the Pope - was that the Bishop of Rome refused to annul or make invalid his marriage to Catherine of Aragon in order to allow him marry Anne Boleyn. There were of course many reasons for this, not least among them being that Catherine was the aunt of Charles V of Spain, the Holy Roman Emperor and an important ally of the then pope, Clement VII, the sanctity of marriage (the moreso between a king and his wife) within the Catholic Church, and the possibility of disinheriting and effectively bastardising Catherine's daughter Mary, who would be next in line to the throne.

So Henry decided, after trying to cajole, force or trick the pope into annulling the marriage, he didn't need him. He would do it himself, and so, like a child annoyed at the rules of the game and making his own game, taking his ball and going home, Henry VIII of England set himself up as head of his own religion, his own breakaway faction from the Church, following (mostly, or as far as it benefited him to do so) the precepts of the fledgling Protestant movement being taught and disseminated by Martin Luther, thereby creating the Church of England and making England a Protestant country.

But consider: what if the pope had allowed the annulment? Yes, the historical ramifications would have been huge - Queen Mary, known to history as "Bloody Mary" for her persecution of Protestants when she came to power - would never have ruled, and her sister, Elizabeth, would have ascended the throne unopposed, rather than, as she was, seen throughout her reign by Catholics - the pope especially - as a bastard and a Protestant usurper. Plots to dethrone or assassinate her would not have been hatched, and in all likelihood, England might have been stronger against its enemies, being a cohesive, truly united kingdom.

Apart from the Scots, of course. Damn Scots! They ruined Scotland!

Meanwhile, Ireland might not have been such a prize, or, if it was, might have acceded more readily to a king who followed the same religion as them. Much of the opposition to England's invasion and occupation and rule of Ireland was that it was performed under the banner of Protestantism, the Anglican Protestantism taught by and compulsorily required by the Church of England. Irish Catholics feared the erosion, even destruction of their faith, and so fought with everything they had against this foreign oppressor. But had Henry got what he wanted from the pope, it's highly unlikely England would have changed religions. Up until the time of the "king's great matter" as they referred to his pending demand for divorce or annulment of his marriage to Catherine, Protestants and Lutherans in England were seen as heretics, and imprisoned, tortured and burned with the full approval and knowledge of the king. It was only when Henry began to see - or be shown, by men like Thomas Cromwell and Thomas Cranmer, who had much to gain by swaying His Majesty's allegiances their way, including of course not to have to do a good impersonation of a candle - that allowing, even embracing and finally insisting on Luther's new anti-Rome religion could help him to get what he needed that he broke with Rome.

Though there were plenty of Protestants in England at the time, and many at Henry's court, before the "great matter" (or before the king met Anne Boleyn) none of them would have admitted it, for to be branded a follower of Luther was to repudiate the Catholic Church, seen at the time as the only Church, and Luther's ideas as heretical and nothing more than the ramblings of a sect or cult leader, and that was punishable by death, usually very painful death. Henry's about-turn in accepting Protestantism was motivated purely by his own lust and his desire to get his own way, and set in motion by the refusal of the pope to grant this.

So had Henry either been able to keep it in his pants, or convince the pope that kicking Catherine to the kerb was the best policy, England might now still be a Catholic country, and everything from the Famine to the Rising and right up to the Troubles need never have happened.

The first and only time I have heard of in history where a man set up an entire religion and his people were later persecuted, imprisoned, burned and hanged because the king wanted to get his end away. Well, technically he could do that anyway, but since Durex would not be invented for about another four hundred years, he wanted to make sure any sprogs his new bit of totty dropped were legitimate heirs, especially if he hit the jackpot and got a son.

[QuantumSync]

Yup.

From Four Green Fields:

Intermission: Catholic England? The Trouser Serpent Enters Eden

Here I'd like to diverge slightly away from the timeline, and look back to see how things could have been different, for Ireland and for England. What I'll propose here will of course be simplistic and I'm sure there are plenty of valid reasons for the hatreds between our two countries, but it can't be denied that the biggest bone of contention - even when England left a remnant of its eight-hundred-year occupation behind it to stagger through almost into the twenty-first century - between us has been religion.

So, the question becomes: what if England had remained Catholic?

It's not as crazy a question, I think, as it seems. England had been, after all, staunchly Catholic for thousands of years, if only because up to then there was only Catholicism in Christianity. It was the early fifteenth century that saw the rise of Martin  Luther and what would become known as Protestantism, which slowly spread across Europe, but England resisted it, even to the point of its then king, Henry VIII, writing in vigorous defence of Catholicism and denouncing Luther, earning him the title Fidei Defensor, or Defender of the Faith, bestowed upon him by a grateful Pope Leo X. Remember, at this point England was a world power, and the pope would have been concerned had its king turned against him. Of course, later that's exactly what he did (though not specifically against the Pope himself, but against his allies) but that's history and here we're considering an alternate timeline.

Henry's problem with Catholicism - or more properly, the Pope - was that the Bishop of Rome refused to annul or make invalid his marriage to Catherine of Aragon in order to allow him marry Anne Boleyn. There were of course many reasons for this, not least among them being that Catherine was the aunt of Charles V of Spain, the Holy Roman Emperor and an important ally of the then pope, Clement VII, the sanctity of marriage (the moreso between a king and his wife) within the Catholic Church, and the possibility of disinheriting and effectively bastardising Catherine's daughter Mary, who would be next in line to the throne.

So Henry decided, after trying to cajole, force or trick the pope into annulling the marriage, he didn't need him. He would do it himself, and so, like a child annoyed at the rules of the game and making his own game, taking his ball and going home, Henry VIII of England set himself up as head of his own religion, his own breakaway faction from the Church, following (mostly, or as far as it benefited him to do so) the precepts of the fledgling Protestant movement being taught and disseminated by Martin Luther, thereby creating the Church of England and making England a Protestant country.

But consider: what if the pope had allowed the annulment? Yes, the historical ramifications would have been huge - Queen Mary, known to history as "Bloody Mary" for her persecution of Protestants when she came to power - would never have ruled, and her sister, Elizabeth, would have ascended the throne unopposed, rather than, as she was, seen throughout her reign by Catholics - the pope especially - as a bastard and a Protestant usurper. Plots to dethrone or assassinate her would not have been hatched, and in all likelihood, England might have been stronger against its enemies, being a cohesive, truly united kingdom.

Apart from the Scots, of course. Damn Scots! They ruined Scotland!

Meanwhile, Ireland might not have been such a prize, or, if it was, might have acceded more readily to a king who followed the same religion as them. Much of the opposition to England's invasion and occupation and rule of Ireland was that it was performed under the banner of Protestantism, the Anglican Protestantism taught by and compulsorily required by the Church of England. Irish Catholics feared the erosion, even destruction of their faith, and so fought with everything they had against this foreign oppressor. But had Henry got what he wanted from the pope, it's highly unlikely England would have changed religions. Up until the time of the "king's great matter" as they referred to his pending demand for divorce or annulment of his marriage to Catherine, Protestants and Lutherans in England were seen as heretics, and imprisoned, tortured and burned with the full approval and knowledge of the king. It was only when Henry began to see - or be shown, by men like Thomas Cromwell and Thomas Cranmer, who had much to gain by swaying His Majesty's allegiances their way, including of course not to have to do a good impersonation of a candle - that allowing, even embracing and finally insisting on Luther's new anti-Rome religion could help him to get what he needed that he broke with Rome.

Though there were plenty of Protestants in England at the time, and many at Henry's court, before the "great matter" (or before the king met Anne Boleyn) none of them would have admitted it, for to be branded a follower of Luther was to repudiate the Catholic Church, seen at the time as the only Church, and Luther's ideas as heretical and nothing more than the ramblings of a sect or cult leader, and that was punishable by death, usually very painful death. Henry's about-turn in accepting Protestantism was motivated purely by his own lust and his desire to get his own way, and set in motion by the refusal of the pope to grant this.

So had Henry either been able to keep it in his pants, or convince the pope that kicking Catherine to the kerb was the best policy, England might now still be a Catholic country, and everything from the Famine to the Rising and right up to the Troubles need never have happened.

The first and only time I have heard of in history where a man set up an entire religion and his people were later persecuted, imprisoned, burned and hanged because the king wanted to get his end away. Well, technically he could do that anyway, but since Durex would not be invented for about another four hundred years, he wanted to make sure any sprogs his new bit of totty dropped were legitimate heirs, especially if he hit the jackpot and got a son.

Thank you for that post! That was a great read, and very informational. I lol'ed at the "taking my ball and going home" & "keep it in his pants". It really is interesting though that you say how all of that could have been avoided possibly. I don't know much about kings in England or Ireland or anywhere really but I do want to learn more. You're very knowledge Trollheart, I'll go back and read the MB threads or if they are posted here too.

[Psy-Fi]

Dublin Halloween parade hoax dupes thousands into packing Ireland capital's streets for nothing

[jimmy jazz]

😂😂😂😂😂

[jimmy jazz]

Fuck it leaving these here.

Classic.

"Shit she's not alroyt!"

"Got a nice bump on ye head der"

😂