Something Completely Different

Quote from: Guybrush on Mar 28, 2023, 06:43 PMWho's a good candidate? Your VP?

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Mar 28, 2023, 07:20 PMI knew Biden and Harris were going to be pretty mediocre, which is why I was in favor of Yang until he got yang-ked out of the race.

Quote from: Guybrush on Mar 28, 2023, 08:19 PM^Is he getting proposals blocked by senate or is his administration just not making them at all?

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Mar 28, 2023, 07:38 PMnow what was it i was voting for exactly

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Mar 28, 2023, 07:38 PMi voted for biden only because he wasn't trump -

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Mar 28, 2023, 06:12 PMwe seriously need to dump this clown

QuoteAs for the thread topic and OP, I agree with the underlying proposal, but would word it differently:-

Isn't it time we let this octogenarian retire with a bit of still-intact dignity? As a lead-up to the 2024 election, he should clearly endorse a younger, more energetic candidate, such as Liz Warren or AOC. 

Quote from: Lisnaholic on Apr 11, 2023, 04:12 PMIsn't it time we let this octogenarian retire with a bit of still-intact dignity? As a lead-up to the 2024 election, he should clearly endorse a younger, more energetic candidate, such as Liz Warren or AOC. 

QuoteI like AOC for the most part but she is going to come off as too extreme to even get the nom much less the general election.

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Apr 11, 2023, 04:54 PMI think AOC would do pretty well against Trump but would struggle against a DeSantis or a Vivek on the debate stage (talking 2024 here). And she'd need a budget like Michael Bloomberg's to just run ads all day and not debate anyone.

She could probably crush 2028 though.

Quoteyoung attractive energetic latina

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 11, 2023, 04:30 PMgood call - maybe even wise octogenarian and leave off the "bit of still-intact" and instead of "should clearly" it could be "pass his proud legacy unto" or something something

i'm new at this politeness thing but i'm making steady progress

Quote from: Rubber Soul on Apr 11, 2023, 04:35 PMHate to break the news to you but Warren (who I supported in the 2020 primaries) isn't exactly a spring chicken either. I like AOC for the most part but she is going to come off as too extreme to even get the nom much less the general election.

Quote from: Trollheart on Apr 12, 2023, 03:46 PMI'm still staggered by the fact that Trump could be president from jail! Are you guys just having fun with a thick Oirishman or what? Every other country would have a man with a criminal record disqualified from running for public office, but you would allow one who is actually incarcerated to be the most powerful man on the planet? Come on: tell me it's all a big joke. It must be. Surely?

Quote from: Trollheart on Apr 12, 2023, 03:46 PMI'm still staggered by the fact that Trump could be president from jail! Are you guys just having fun with a thick Oirishman or what? Every other country would have a man with a criminal record disqualified from running for public office, but you would allow one who is actually incarcerated to be the most powerful man on the planet? Come on: tell me it's all a big joke. It must be. Surely?

Quote from: Trollheart on Apr 12, 2023, 03:46 PMI'm still staggered by the fact that Trump could be president from jail! Are you guys just having fun with a thick Oirishman or what? Every other country would have a man with a criminal record disqualified from running for public office, but you would allow one who is actually incarcerated to be the most powerful man on the planet? Come on: tell me it's all a big joke. It must be. Surely?

Quote from: Trollheart on Apr 13, 2023, 07:45 PMNo.

Assassination attempt on POTUS in Ireland!  :laughing:  :laughing:  :laughing:

https://www.rte.ie/news/biden-in-ireland/2023/0413/1376820-biden-camogie/?at_medium=email&at_emailtype=retention&at_campaign=website&at_creation=News%20Newsletter%20&at_link=Automated%20Newsletter&at_recipient_list=2&at_send_date=20230413

Quote from: SGR on Apr 23, 2023, 03:51 PMI have a fairly centrist Uncle who voted for Trump in 2016, ended up very much disliking him and what he did (and didn't do), so he begrudingly voted for Biden in 2020, and now he's in the same position with him. He says if it's Trump and Biden again, he's not voting. He desparately wants new blood to run, someone in their 40s or 50s. I can't say I disagree with him.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 23, 2023, 04:16 PMdo you know if he voted for obama

because if he did (and he's white) he'd probably vote for aoc

anyone who voted for trump after the 2016 election isn't really a centrist (or at least he wasn't then) sounds more like a joe six pack

Quote from: Rubber Soul on Apr 23, 2023, 04:33 PMSGR's uncle sounds pretty typical to me. He's more worried about paying the mortgage than wondering if Lulu can have an abortion. The politician who can break through by being practical (and has the charisma to go along with it) would have a great shot at winning. Who that would be, I have no idea.

QuoteRFK Jr. kinda has me interested. I don't know if he can be that guy or not.
 

Quote from: Trollheart on Apr 25, 2023, 01:23 AMYou do know RFK Jr. consorts with Nazis? Isn't he that one? He is that one, isn't he?

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 25, 2023, 02:02 AMhe's a crank

wtf

Quote from: SGR on Apr 25, 2023, 04:15 AMBecause of the shit he's said about vaccines, you mean?

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 25, 2023, 04:21 AMyes

Quote from: Jwb on Apr 25, 2023, 05:03 AMIf they nominated anyone other than the incumbent that candidate would be working at a massive disadvantage.  It's almost certainly a recipe for throwing the election.

Quote from: Jwb on Apr 25, 2023, 05:03 AMIf they nominated anyone other than the incumbent that candidate would be working at a massive disadvantage.  It's almost certainly a recipe for throwing the election.

Quote from: SGR on Apr 25, 2023, 05:09 AMFair point. Historically, I don't think a party has ever won the general when they snubbed the incumbent president for the nomination. At the same time though, historically, there's probably never been a president as old, seemingly senile, or mealy-mouthed as Biden running for reelection (Reagan would've probably come close if he was able to run for a third term).

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 25, 2023, 05:09 AMwhy?

Quote from: Jwb on Apr 25, 2023, 05:47 AMi think the senility angle is really overplayed with biden. He's never been a particularly good speaker even when he was in his prime, and of course that is only exacerbated by old age but that was already true in 2020 when he won the first time around.  Bush jr was an even worse speaker tbh and he got his two terms even after starting an unpopular war.

It really comes down to the culture war and how mobilized each side can get their respective constituents to get out there and vote. The lines are already drawn for the most part. It's not as much about winning over independents as it is about mobilizing the base. That much was demonstrated by the last election.

Quote from: Jwb on Apr 25, 2023, 06:08 AMWe should have Joe Biden enter the 2024 debates on one of those chairs that takes old women up the stairs like Tony Soprano's mom had. It could be like his version of the Trump escalator.

Quote from: SGR on Apr 26, 2023, 11:11 PMOur president being a hypocrite? Say it aint so!!

I'm imagining that Biden recently announced his run for reelection through a pre-recorded video instead of a live speech because his staffers probably feared he'd accidentally announce a run for reelection in the Senate.

Quote from: Jwb on Apr 27, 2023, 02:40 AMI'm sorry but i spent the entire 2020 cycle listening to people swear up and down he would lose for exactly the reasons above.  Nothing drastic has changed in the meantime regarding his health or mental faculties.  So I'm not exactly convinced this time around. It's about as convincing as swearing trump can't win because he's too brash and uncouth, after watching people say that all through 2016 only for him to end up winning anyway.

QuoteI wonder what the debates will be like if it's Trump and Biden again?

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 27, 2023, 05:03 AMprobably very funny
 
trump couldn't keep quiet if he tried

they might not even debate

desantis would obliterate biden

Quote from: Jwb on Apr 27, 2023, 05:27 AMHe doesnt have a single charismatic bone in his body. He's a complete empty suit. The GOP is just desperate to find a Trump lite candidate without all the baggage.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 27, 2023, 05:47 AMi don't feel his charisma but i don't really like taylor swift either

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 27, 2023, 05:47 AMi don't feel his charisma but i don't really like taylor swift either

Quote from: Mrs. Waffles on Apr 27, 2023, 02:45 PMI like Taylor Swift's music because it reminds me of being a teenager. I'm not a "swiftie" and her fan cult is as frightening to me as anyone.

And yeah, Desantis is terrifying because he's an iron-fisted wannabe dictator. He's not there to be a likable guy. I can only hope that turns off a lot of moderates but I ain't holding my breath.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 27, 2023, 03:06 PMi think his anti-trans stuff could be neutralized if the message wasn't so much like "trans women ARE women" but more like "yeah we're a little different but so fucking what?"

the complexity of gender and all that is a loser just like race isn't real

i mean if you're smart and can dig deep those positions will resonate as deep truths but if you're just whatever it feels like you're being gaslighted "so black people aren't really black people and women can have ding dongs, puhleeze!"

and with terfs i think it should just be like if you want your own afab only club fine but you're gonna miss all the best parties

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 27, 2023, 02:48 PMif i debated trump i'd out trump his ass so bad

they'd be like "mr toy revolver what are you going to do about gun control" and i'd be like we're gonna on dig up trump's mother and fuck her corpse

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Apr 27, 2023, 02:07 PMDeSantis is basically a Rhodes Scholar compared to either Biden or Trump.  It isn't about charisma - on his worst day he's still a strong debater and I'm sure both Biden and Trump are aware they'd get crushed by him if they're put into that situation.  That's why we are seeing Trump say stuff like "why should I even show up at a debate with other Republicans" right now - he knows if he gets up there he's gonna get wrecked.

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 27, 2023, 04:17 PMhahahaha what a post

Quote from: SGR on Apr 27, 2023, 07:02 AMI don't get the obsession with Taylor Swift. Her music is mid. And yeah, no charisma or unique draw. Physical attraction goes a long ways I guess. Even still, I prefer curves in women. Bebe Rexha over Swift any day of the week.

(https://pbs.twimg.com/media/FdIJwUJXgAkcdVe?format=jpg&name=large)

QuoteI suppose I agree to some extent in terms of explaining transness to the general public. But honestly I don't think it matters how palatable we try to make ourselves to cis America, the right wing propaganda machine wants us all gone, and I don't think there's much we can say in our defense that will make them lay off us.

QuoteI think anti-trans hate is just one symptom of a wider anti-feminist movement by the Christian right. The obsession with fertility and babymaking, the total conformity to antiquated ideas of rigid masculinity and femininity, the anti-abortion and anti-birth control stance, it's all connected and it's all starting to feel very Handmaid's Tale-esque.

Quote from: jadis on Apr 27, 2023, 04:27 PMPhysical attraction to what though? To her elbows? That's Taylor's most prominent physical feature afaic. She's uniquely sexless. Probably all smooth down there like a Barbie doll

That Bebe Rexha though https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=p0E9urVs-2o

Quote from: SGR on Apr 27, 2023, 04:20 PMI have issues with brevity lol

To make up for my novel, he's another dashing picture of Bebe Rexha:

(https://i.pinimg.com/originals/04/87/94/0487941a302684668c248ca6451cd60f.jpg)

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 27, 2023, 04:37 PMShe's OK. She no Dua Lipa though.

QuoteAnd if DeSantis can't sharpen his image and presentation, people are going to view him as the uncharismatic tribute band for Donald Trump.

QuoteI think anti-trans hate is just one symptom of a wider anti-feminist movement by the Christian right. The obsession with fertility and babymaking, the total conformity to antiquated ideas of rigid masculinity and femininity, the anti-abortion and anti-birth control stance, it's all connected and it's all starting to feel very Handmaid's Tale-esque.

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 27, 2023, 04:37 PMShe's OK. She no Dua Lipa though.

Quote from: jadis on Apr 27, 2023, 04:48 PMThere's no shortage of this, in America or elsewhere. But that doesn't explain why so many feminist and queer activists of the older generation (the so-called Second Wave feminists, though this label doesn't do justice to the variety of this phenomenon) are what I'd like to call "skeptical of some of the claims of the trans discourse" and many other would call "terfs". For every Judith Butler (https://www.thepinknews.com/2021/10/26/judith-butler-anti-gender-ideology/) there are quite a few Germaine Greers (https://www.bbc.com/news/av/uk-34625512). It's a very diverse phenomenon with multiple viewpoints 

Quote from: jadis on Apr 27, 2023, 04:48 PMThere's no shortage of this, in America or elsewhere. But that doesn't explain why so many feminist and queer activists of the older generation (the so-called Second Wave feminists, though this label doesn't do justice to the variety of this phenomenon) are what I'd like to call "skeptical of some of the claims of the trans discourse" and many other would call "terfs". For every Judith Butler (https://www.thepinknews.com/2021/10/26/judith-butler-anti-gender-ideology/) there are quite a few Germaine Greers (https://www.bbc.com/news/av/uk-34625512). It's a very diverse phenomenon with multiple viewpoints 

Quote from: Mrs. Waffles on Apr 27, 2023, 05:02 PMA lot of TERFs who claim to be feminists still ally with right wing and even openly fascist people. I guess they hate trans people more than they care about that. I consider them useful idiots in a lot of ways. Whether they are aware of it or not, the theocratic fascist right is not on their side. Once they get rid of us, they'll come for the gay people, then the feminists, then the women who show too much ankle.

For the record I think there is a discussion to be had about stuff like sports and prisons. But the minute anyone's desire to protect cis women only spaces turns into support for hormone bans and forced detransition, it's not a discussion anymore.

QuoteA lot of TERFs who claim to be feminists still ally with right wing and even openly fascist people.

Quotethe minute anyone's desire to protect cis women only spaces turns into support for hormone bans and forced detransition, it's not a discussion anymore

Quotebut a shared belief that women exist as a biological class (and water's wet and the moon's not made of cheese) does not an ally make. I believe women are susceptible to certain harms and have specific needs and that feminism is necessary to secure and protect our rights. 3/4

Walsh believes feminism is 'rotten' and his default appears to be denigrating women with whom he disagrees. He's no more on my side than the 'shut up or we'll bomb you' charmers who cloak their misogyny in a pretty pink and blue flag. 4/4

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 27, 2023, 05:39 PM- jk rowling (just taken ofc twitter)

i feel like that's sort of like saying if i say well desantis was right about that trans swimmer that means i support desantis

(idk much about that story though)

Quote from: SGR on Apr 27, 2023, 04:02 PMCharisma might not be a big deal when you're running for governor, but as a national candidate for President, you'll have a difficult time getting people to go out and vote for you without it. And if DeSantis can't sharpen his image and presentation, people are going to view him as the uncharismatic tribute band for Donald Trump. And not many are going to want to go out and vote for the tribute band when they could instead see the original act.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 27, 2023, 04:45 PMi'm not going to see queensryche and the melvins when i can see pink floyd and black sabbath

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 27, 2023, 04:32 PMit matters i think because it's good to make the fringe right seem fringe - right now they use confusion to attract joe sixpack -

also i don't want to talk to you like you're part of a monolith

in fact, trans people take every approach imaginable and many a variety and many are non-political

i mean just like any group every individual has their own brain

some of those people are non-negotiable but some are flexible- people believe things one day then claim they never believed it the next

if there's a messaging problem maybe it can be improved upon and maybe there's too much orthodoxy

it used to be like everyone thought all gays were super flamboyant- then it was like dink (double income no kids) and suddenly a lot of (not all) corporate america loved them some gay

the image changed, now i think the typical whoever don't see gays as a monolith but as individuals

i know you express a lot of concern about the political climate and i hear you there's huge cause for alarm but i still think you're actually proof of the progress and whether you wanted it or not i think that's why we love you on here - we should or i should love you the same trans or not but i can't help but love you more because you're a living representive of the inclusive world i want to live in but i also know i have to respect it's not your duty to be an avatar for something for me

it feels related to me the way many poor whites in the rural wherever are presented as hating blacks and voting against their financial interests as long as their whiteness is acknowledged

but i have been in the boonies a pretty lot - granted i'm white but i also think the ultra bigoted redneck is largely a social media fiction but the fiction is so widespread that they feel under attack

that's part of the reason why i'm so into the southern white trash thing

those cunts cannot define my culture i define my own fucking culture not twitter or cnbc or anyone that isn't me

and yes i'm going here again

it starts with loving the poor and economic justice

randon as fuck i know

Quote from: SGR on Apr 27, 2023, 04:02 PMI disagree that it's not about charisma. Charisma is only part of the equation though. Just look at how well Kamala or Bloomberg did in the Dem primaries compared to the other candidates.

I'm not sure if Trump's trial balloon suggestion of not doing the debates is serious or not. But I doubt it's because he fears he's 'going to get wrecked'. I just think he knows that with his sizable lead right now, assuming it remained that way up until the first debate, he'd have little to gain, and a fair bit to lose. This assumes the debate even happens. If the only people polling high enough to qualify are Chris Christie, Vivek Ramaswamy, and Nikki Haley (assuming DeSantis doesn't run), all in the single digits, would the RNC even hold the debate? Would it be worth it for Trump to show up and put himself in a position where he'll be the complete focal point for the other candidates to try and attack and criticize? Of course, if they hold the debate and he decides to skip it, he'll face accusations that he's a coward who's afraid of the other candidates - but if he's dominating polls, would that even matter?

Charisma might not be a big deal when you're running for governor, but as a national candidate for President, you'll have a difficult time getting people to go out and vote for you without it. And if DeSantis can't sharpen his image and presentation, people are going to view him as the uncharismatic tribute band for Donald Trump. And not many are going to want to go out and vote for the tribute band when they could instead see the original act.

Even if DeSantis is a better debater in an academic sense, when he's in front of a national audience with Trump throwing jabs and personal attacks and jokes at him, do you think he's going to come out of that looking better? Or will he fumble and crumble, and look weak and ineffective compared to Trump?

Ron DeSanctimonious is probably only the warm-up nickname. If he gets in the race and on that debate stage, there will be more - especially if he answers questions like this:

Meatball Ron? Bobblehead Ron? There's many options. Trump is shameless, so these kinds of tactics don't really work well against him. But he has an impressive ability to hone in on the weakness and vulnerabilities of others and drink from that well until it's dry, e.g. John Kasich's table manners:

Quote from: Jwb on Apr 28, 2023, 04:50 AMdon't you think the image of gays changed largely due to increased exposure, normalization, etc?

I think it was that much more than the idea of gay rights activists dialing back their rhetoric.  If anything,  i remember the same conversations about how people were fine with gays but resented having it "shoved down their throats" (pause) in the form of pride parades, Will and Grace, queer eye for the straight guy, etc. Gays really never dialed it back but eventually it just became common place and open enough that it was no longer a dirty little secret that could be openly despised by the mainstream. Then we move in to the stage where people are forced to conceal their hate.  Which is progress.

I sorta agree with the idea that it really doesn't matter that much atm the specific arguments being made in favor of trans rights. They have the spotlight from people who don't value their input. I.E. the influencers and pundits and politicians that will make a career off of it.

Those people will keep banging that drum until they eventually lose the culture war.  They aren't going to be argued out of it.

The average joe six pack, on the other hand,  listens to those people.  Eventually they stop listening as much over time, as the culture moves on.

I'm not saying don't make whatever type of argument.  But really you might as well stand on "trans women are women" if that's what you believe rather than sugar coat it cause in effect that moves the goal post a little further in your opponents direction. Makes it so that on the one extreme you have a fairly moderate take and on the other end you have a fairly far right take.

Quote from: Jwb on Apr 28, 2023, 05:20 AMi agree charmisa is important but let's not forget biden basically won on an anti Trump platform and had 0 charisma.  If you can rally your base against the common enemy,  you can get by without it.

Problem being that while the GOP keeps flirting with people like DeSantis based on the idea Trump has too much baggage,  they fundamentally don't hate Trump.  In fact they still sorta like him,they just resent the baggage. So i don't think that Trump will provide the same benefit to DeSantis that he did to biden.  But all this to say i think things are pretty much up in the air at this point.  It's a pure guessing game.  If i were forced to bet right now,  I'd bet on biden getting his second term. I'm not at all confident in that but i haven't seen anything from either Trump or DeSantis so far that would make me change that bet.

QuoteI'd also say he's more likable than Elizabeth Warren too, who always came off to me like a humorless schoolmarm. 

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Apr 28, 2023, 06:52 PMi don't remember her being at all funny but i love her politics and it was her that greatly expanded bankruptcy laws to combat predatory lending

and she doesn't seem so creepily power hunger like the worst boss you ever had like hillary

i'm not saying you're wrong but i like her but pochahantas was a hilarious nickname

QuoteAnd it was refreshing to support a woman who seemed more worried about the direction of the country than her own personal ambitions.

Quote from: SGR on Apr 28, 2023, 04:31 PMI wouldn't say that Joe had zero charisma, I think that's underselling him a bit. He had more charisma when he was younger, when he could sell his ice cream and corn pop stories without fumbling the words as much, but he certainly is more likable than Kamala or Bloomberg (low bar as that might be). I'd also say he's more likable than Elizabeth Warren too, who always came off to me like a humorless schoolmarm.

For his 2020 run though, Biden, unlike DeSantis, had the luxury of already spending 8 years in the national spotlight as Vice President. Regardless of who the GOP nominates, they'll be vilified by the D-leaning media (just as the R-leaning media vilifies the Democrat candidate) - and DeSantis probably has more that he can be vilfied for than the other non-Trump GOP candidates. Without the proper amount of charisma and personality, I don't think he's going to be able to win moderates over in the face of the villification. He'll just be a younger version of McCain or Romney in terms of personality with a policy prescription closer to Trump.

Quote from: Jwb on Apr 29, 2023, 05:35 AMi mean there were like 20 people on stage in 2020. A few of them were bound to have less personality than Joe Biden but that's really not saying much to me.  But sure, 0 charisma might be hyperbole but he's been a fucking bore and a stuttering prick for as long as i remember.  I don't even remember anyone liking him when he was Obama's VP. He used to be known as a gaffe machine and a liability even back then from what i recall.

Quote from: SGR on Apr 29, 2023, 10:30 PMI don't know about right now, but before he was elected in 2020, I remember seeing a poll that showed that black women absolutely loved him and trusted him.

QuoteWWIII on the Installment Plan
The Invention of a Wartime Presidency to Save the Biden Administration

DENNIS KUCINICH
MAY 4, 2023


Has the Russia-Ukraine war blown up the global nuclear order? - Bulletin of  the Atomic Scientists
Illustration by Thomas Gaulkin
Yesterday's attempt to attack the Kremlin with a drone strike, supposedly to assassinate Vladimir Putin, is being pinned on Ukraine. But this is a proxy war of the U.S. versus Russia, and no one is fooled. Ukraine is a simply a U.S. pawn and can make no major moves without checking with Washington.

The U.S. has successfully muzzled its energy-starved allies in Europe from even objecting to, let alone investigating the destruction of the Nord Stream pipeline.  Europe is stuck with the skyrocketing cost of U.S. supplied replacement fuel.

The destruction of Nord Stream followed well-publicized mock U.S. nuclear strikes targeting Russia and the equally provocative shipment of depleted-uranium munitions transferred to the Ukraine battlefield through our "special relationship" with the British government. The Russian government has publicly warned that the use of such weapons, as were used by the U.S. in Iraq and Syria, will lead to escalation.

The Biden Administration has done everything it could to incite a hot war directly between the U.S. and Russia, sacrificing Ukrainian youth and the majesty of Ukrainian cities.

The drone strike and the depleted uranium transfer are made to look like the West is somehow succeeding in the battle which, for all intents and purposes, will soon come to an end— with a phony declaration of victory of sorts (definitely not for Ukrainians). Then the infernal Enemy Engine will pivot its wrath and venom towards CHINA.

Get ready for a parceling out of some of the manufactured hate that has been reserved for Russia and President Putin -- to hate China and President Xi, and to suffer a fully-machinated Red Peril.

One need only to look at the "Down Under" Australian press' frightful China fear-mongering to know what we in the 'Up Above' can expect.  This has been well chronicled by Caitlin Johnstone, whose Substack posts are a must read.

The Biden Administration, having unsuccessfully diminished the Russian economy with its broad sanctions, and having failed to defeat the Russian military, will soon lead us to believe that the same geniuses in Washington, London and Belgium who brought us the war in Ukraine, will somehow succeed in holding in check China, or perhaps even toppling President Xi, through military means.

The depraved thinking that resulted in approximately $140 billion wasted for the war in Ukraine and the deaths of hundreds of thousands of Ukrainian and Russian soldiers, countenances even greater opportunities in the East.

Witness:  The U.S. has brought Australia, South Korea, Japan into an alliance against China and is pressuring the Philippines and Indonesia to join in as we ship arms to Taiwan. The intent is to bait China, to try to make Taiwan the next Ukraine, while coordinating submarine patrols amidst risible plans to send ships from the EU to patrol the Straits of Taiwan.  If China did something similar in our sphere, Congress would declare war.

The geographically-confused North Atlantic Treaty Organization, (NATO) ever ready to be the U.S.' wrecking ball, now considers China "a threat to global security." Remember, China has brokered a peace deal between Saudi Arabia and Iran, and attempted to do so in Ukraine.

Remember, the U.S. has 800 military bases abroad and China has zero.

Remember, China is holding almost a trillion dollars of US debt.

So, what is this all about?  The White House, which bet on the forbearance of a nuclear-armed Russia, in a conventional proxy war in Ukraine, is similarly counting on the forbearance of nuclear-armed China in a conventional war over Taiwan.  Thus is the horror of unfettered brinkmanship.

NBC News obtained a memo in January where a four-star general instructed his logistical command of nearly 50,000 to get ready for war with China by 2025.  His charges were told to further prepare by getting their "legal affairs" in order and to engage in the calisthenics of war, by firing an ammo clip often at a target and to aim for the head.  Is this just hysterical puffery?

The 2022 National Security Strategy of the United States identified China as the greatest military and economic threat to the United States. Forget that Mr. Biden voted for China trade, NAFTA and the WTO, all which sharply eroded America's strategic industrial base of steel, automotive, aerospace and shipping and ultimately set the stage for China's rise as a world power.  Forget that we have shipped high technology to military labs in China – and the Ukraine.

While the US continues its military muscle-flexing globally, incurring rising resentment in its continual challenges to the very idea of national sovereignty, China has focused instead on economic expansion, assisting in economic development throughout the world and strengthening the capacities of nations to support their own interests.  China has played the long game, while US leaders have played the wrong game.

So, with only sanctions as a tool, the US has limited options to respond to China, except for war.

If the Biden Administration continues to ramp up for war against China, it could mean the end, not of China, but of the United States itself.

China and Russia are not natural allies, to say the least.  However, with NATO encroachment, the placement of missiles on Russia's border, the war in Ukraine, the blowing up of the Nord Stream pipeline, the U.S. has pushed Russia into China's waiting arms.

As a result of the proxy war against Russia in Ukraine, together with the saber rattling over Taiwan, we have forced a once unthinkable China-Russia alliance whose combined manufacturing, energy production and offensive capabilities exceed that of the US.

A US war with China will not only bring in Russia on China's side, but likely India, Brazil, and Iran.  That is, if such a war were "conventional," meaning not nuclear.  However, the idea of containing such a war to conventional weapons is pure fantasy.

The Biden Administration's cyclopean foreign policy will be the ruin of us all.

There is not a shred of diplomatic skill exhibited by the Sullivan-Blinken-Nuland troika.  They pull away from treaties.  Engage in continual provocations.  Recklessly spend hundreds of billions of taxpayers' dollars on military adventures.  It's escalate, escalate, escalate.   The defense contractors, the war profiteers as FDR rightfully called them, cash in and the rest of us lose.

The average American family has seen nearly $100,000 of its wealth spent on regime change adventures since 2001, with highly negative results for our country and the world.  The U.S. is viewed in many circles as the greatest threat to world peace. Alarmingly and poignantly, the national debt is close to $100,000 per person in America.

While the Biden Administration plans for a hot war with China in 2025, the White House will use cold war psychology now, for the 2024 election season, to scare the bejesus out of even the most pacific U.S. voter.  And, with the help of the American media, which has largely been reduced to a posse of electronic spear carriers, we will be afflicted with every 'alarm of struggle and flight' appropriate to cowing Americans into silence and compliance. 

President Biden, like President George W. Bush in the Iraq War, will seek to burnish his Commander in Chief status as a war-time president, beginning in the later part of 2023.  Going into 2024, the American people will be told not to change presidents in the middle of a manufactured war.

Unless held in check by the voters, President Biden's foreign policy handlers are merrily leading America and the world down the path of World War III.  New Hampshire, are you listening?

Quote from: Trollheart on May 05, 2023, 12:03 AMWhat the fuck is this? US attacked the Kremlin? Drone strike? Why is this not on the news?

And how Russia-slanted is that piece? Blaming the US for the war? Like, Biden invaded Ukraine??

QuoteThe new nuclear deterrence effort calls for periodically docking U.S. nuclear-armed submarines in South Korea for the first time in decades, bolstering training between the two countries, and more. The declaration was unveiled as Biden hosted Yoon for a state visit at a moment of heightened anxiety over an increased pace of ballistic missile tests by North Korea.

QuoteHow the Kremlin drone attack hands Russia an opportunity

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 05, 2023, 01:03 AMAnd in general how is Biden's Cold War level of Hawkishness going unchecked? Constant confrontation with China and all this bullshit about Taiwan. That's not even remotely our business.

Quote from: Psy-Fi on May 05, 2023, 12:52 PMThe level of misinformation, disinformation and propaganda coming from the mainstream American media, The US military, and US elected officials against China is at a level I've never seen in all the years I've been living in America. They seem hellbent on bullying, threatening and provoking China at every opportunity. I think Taiwan is just a convenient pawn for America to play against China in their geopolitical games to try to continue to dominate the world with American military power. Worth noting that the USA currently has military bases in 85 countries located outside of the US while China currently has just 1 military base located outside of China.

QuoteRemember, the U.S. has 800 military bases abroad and China has zero.

Quote from: Trollheart on May 11, 2023, 03:17 AMAnother one that doesn't like my ad blocker. Fuck them.

Quote from: SGR on May 08, 2023, 05:31 PMTrump Crushing Biden By 7 Points in New ABC/Washington Post Survey (https://www.mediaite.com/news/shock-poll-trump-crushing-biden-by-7-points-in-stunning-new-abc-washington-post-survey/)

Quote from: Psy-Fi on May 11, 2023, 03:35 PMCan you imagine Trump getting the Republican nomination and beating Biden in 2024?

It would be unprecedented.

Or would it be "unpresidented?"

Quote from: SGR on May 11, 2023, 05:09 PMI haven't watched the whole thing yet, but here's a clip of it where he's talking about E. Jean Carrol and says: "She had a dog or a cat named 'Vagina'..."  :laughing:

https://twitter.com/alx/status/1656456436350853121

QuotePresident Biden told US forces stationed in Japan that his son Beau perished in the Iraq War, a video obtained exclusively by The Post reveals — after the president stoked questions about his own mental acuity by making the same incorrect claim at least twice last year.

"My son was a major in the US Army. We lost him in Iraq," the 80-year-old president said during an informal visit with troops at Marine Corps Air Station Iwakuni Thursday.

Biden said in October of last year that Beau "lost his life in Iraq" and claimed the following month that Iraq was "where my son died."

In fact, the president's son died of brain cancer in 2015 at the Walter Reed military hospital in Bethesda, Md.

Concern about Biden's mental fitness for office surged in September when he asked "Where's Jackie?" and searched for the late Rep. Jackie Walorski (R-Ind.) at an event — despite publicly mourning her car-accident death and even calling her family to offer his condolences in August.

In December, Biden claimed that his uncle Frank Biden won the Purple Heart for his actions during the Battle of the Bulge in World War II — but there's no evidence of the award and key details make the story factually impossible.

In October, Biden said firefighters nearly died extinguishing a blaze in his kitchen in 2004, prompting the local fire department to describe the event as relatively "insignificant" for trained professionals.

In May, Biden said at the Naval Academy's graduation ceremony that he was appointed to the military school in 1965 by the late Sen. J. Caleb Boggs (R-Del.). A search of Boggs' archives failed to turn up evidence of the appointment.

In January 2022, Biden told students at historically black colleges in Atlanta that he was arrested during civil rights protests — for which there is also no evidence.

Quote from: jimmy jazz on May 23, 2023, 02:07 PMHe is one hell of a bullshitter.

I can't stand him.

Quote from: Psy-Fi on May 23, 2023, 02:46 PMAnd those are just a few recent examples of his shameless BS. It's unreal that he was ever elected to any position in any government, let alone being able to get as far as President of the United States.

Quote from: Psy-Fi on May 23, 2023, 02:01 PMBiden again claimed son Beau died 'in Iraq' (https://nypost.com/2023/05/22/biden-again-claimed-son-beau-died-in-iraq-to-marines-at-japan-stop/)

Quote from: Psy-Fi on May 23, 2023, 02:01 PMBiden again claimed son Beau died 'in Iraq' (https://nypost.com/2023/05/22/biden-again-claimed-son-beau-died-in-iraq-to-marines-at-japan-stop/)

Quote from: SGR on May 23, 2023, 03:17 PMThe thing that makes it so bad is that we currently can't tell if our president has dementia, or is just lying.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 23, 2023, 03:26 PMmaybe we should ask cornpop

QuoteLet's say Biden's doctor did find that he had either dementia or alzheimer's. You think they'd tell us (the public)?

Quote from: jimmy jazz on May 23, 2023, 05:15 PMI think we'd know if he'd been diagnosed. It'd be reported or leaked by now.

And surely he would be advised to step down or something if he'd been diagnosed, whether it's made public or not.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 23, 2023, 05:17 PMit's fraud to lie about it

if you were trump's doctor and you did that you'd go to jail

Quote from: jimmy jazz on May 23, 2023, 05:15 PMI think we'd know if he'd been diagnosed. It'd be reported or leaked by now.

And surely he would be advised to step down or something if he'd been diagnosed, whether it's made public or not.

Quote from: SGR on May 23, 2023, 05:20 PMSure, but fraud happens all the time in politics and no one goes to jail.

Maybe he doesn't have diagnosed dementia, but would any honest doctor at this point give Biden a health assessment and say he's fit to be president? The guy who needs a full time staffer whose job is to help him find his way off of a stage?

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 23, 2023, 05:24 PMhonest doctor

you're funny

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 23, 2023, 05:24 PMhonest doctor

you're funny

Quote from: SGR on May 23, 2023, 05:27 PMHey, it's more likely than an honest lawyer.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 23, 2023, 05:47 PMpublic defenders who work hand-in-hand with the police and the prosecution and judge are a special breed of scum but some lawyers are legit advocates for the disenfranchised and are the real deal snd put their lives on the line

doctors are just fucking bullshit cowardly cunts who let people die in pain instead putting their beach houses at risk

besides the above at least lawyers aren't pretending to be on your side if they really arent

in a city you'll find a solid handful of honest or even respectfully dishonest lawyers

youre lucky to find one honest doctor -

their dishonesty is baked in - even the meaning of the word "doctor" vs the truth of the profession is a lie

Quote from: Nimbly9 on May 23, 2023, 06:38 PMThis one's for you TR.

Quote from: Nimbly9 on May 23, 2023, 06:38 PMThis one's for you TR.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 23, 2023, 07:04 PMthat's crazy

he doesn't even care how much truth was exposed right there either

what war criminals he and ALL US SOLDIERS are

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 23, 2023, 05:47 PMpublic defenders who work hand-in-hand with the police and the prosecution and judge are a special breed of scum but some lawyers are legit advocates for the disenfranchised and are the real deal snd put their lives on the line

doctors are just fucking bullshit cowardly cunts who let people die in pain instead putting their beach houses at risk

besides the above at least lawyers aren't pretending to be on your side if they really arent

in a city you'll find a solid handful of honest or even respectfully dishonest lawyers

youre lucky to find one honest doctor -

their dishonesty is baked in - even the meaning of the word "doctor" vs the truth of the profession is a lie

Quote from: Jwb on May 25, 2023, 03:04 AMthis is such arbitrary nonsense. Doctors can cure you of actual disease.  Lawyersc just know tbf loop holes to help you legally.  Theo benefit from the same system they're defending you from.  Where as disease is a fact of life that is inherent to our natural existence.

Quote from: Jwb on May 25, 2023, 05:21 AMYou're right bruh. Fuck medical science.

Quote from: Jwb on May 26, 2023, 04:09 AMRight so in other words we don't benefit from having doctors around. Good point. Maybe we should go back to bloodletting and leeches.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 26, 2023, 04:36 AMif all drugs were legal and over the counter almost the entire profession would be obsolete

everything including surgery is on the cusp of being automated

and until i can get healthcare without going broke fuck doctors

and hospitals and clinics that turn away people who can't pay should be razed

Quote from: Jwb on May 27, 2023, 02:57 AMlol @ resorting to a prescription of self medicating and robot doctors to try to solve the current problems with our healthcarev system.

Quote from: Jwb on May 27, 2023, 03:33 AMYou throw the first molotov, comrade.

Or, you know, you can continue to cosplay.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 27, 2023, 03:57 AMeven if i wouldn't do it it's still the only method that would work

Quote from: SGR on May 27, 2023, 04:05 AMHow would that work? The cops/government would just kill you and your accomplices and then business as usual.

Quote from: Jwb on May 28, 2023, 09:28 PMThe fact that you and so many like you lack the courage of your convictions means that it will never happen anyway.  So arguing  about whether it will work or not is pointless.

Quote from: Jwb on May 28, 2023, 10:07 PMMission accomplished then.

Quote from: SGR on Mar 28, 2023, 07:00 PMIf she doesn't run this time around, she'll run eventually. I am fully convinced she will be the president - she'll probably be the first woman who will be. She's got more charisma in her pinky than Kamala has ever had. And she's probably the only Democrat who is Trump's equal in terms of getting attention from the media. And as shallow as it may seem, she'll look a lot better on stage and media appearances than most of the old farts who have been running in recent times - that's enough to sway votes - the whole Nixon vs. Kennedy debate reception for those who heard it on the radio (Nixon's favor) vs. those who watched it on TV (Kennedy's favor) sort of deal.

Quote from: DJChameleon on May 29, 2023, 07:17 AMShe won't run this time around because corporate Democrats won't let that happen. Also is she 35? Idk if she is old enough to run yet. Also she's too progressive to the point that corporate democrats are going to push back hard and she will never win a primary let alone be president but nice thoughts though.

Quote from: SGR on May 29, 2023, 07:25 AMI really think her 'radicalness' has been overstated.

Quote from: DJChameleon on May 29, 2023, 07:30 AMTo you and I who follow politics. We know the truth but to the lay person and the rest of the corporate Dems. She's radical as shit. If she ends up going more centrist to fall in line with other Dems. I feel like she would lose her regular supporters in the process that likes her for being more than just a corporate stooge.

Quote from: SGR on May 29, 2023, 07:47 AMAs odd as this might sound, I truly think that with some training, she could effect the Dem party in the same way that Trump did for the R's. Any time she steps into a room she is an energy vampire. She sucks all the life out the room and the focus is completely on her. AOC, like Trump, knows how to manipulate the media. She knows how to get attention. AOC does not need to play to the center in the primaries, she only needs to do so in the general. She'll follow the same formula many politicans before her did.

She can ingratiate herself with the establishment by playing the game until she's ready - she'll support Biden, support the party line, toe the line, etc. She'll work with others behind the scene to ensure them that she's not a threat to the orthodoxy, and after that, the corporate backers will come flowing in (whether she'd decide to enact serious systematic change after she got into office is up for grabs). She's attractive, and this is just the way it works, but that matters a lot. Imagine her on stage with a bunch of old Dem stooges, how do you think she'll look in comparison? How will her energy and presence compare?

I firmly believe she'll be the first woman president, it's just a matter of when. If Trump gets re-elected, I'd bump her chances to 90% of being the president the next cycle. I'm not even saying I'd support her, but this is just what I think/predict. Regardless of that, the idea of seeing someone so young as the leader of our country is a very enticing prospect to me:

(https://media1.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExODFmZDkyMDk1NDdkMjIzM2I5ZWQ0OWVlZDFkM2ExMzZkNGEzNDliNyZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZzX2dpZklkJmN0PWc/ZaQN25RwUCZuAhOlF5/giphy.gif)

QuoteImagine her on stage with a bunch of old Dem stooges, how do you think she'll look in comparison? How will her energy and presence compare? 

QuoteThe bitch been around before my mother's born
I said, "Cheer up," I gave her a kiss
I said, "You can't have me, I'm too young for you miss."
She says, "No, you're not!" then she starts crying
I says, "I'm nineteen," she said, "Stop lying!"
I says, "I am, go ask my mother
And with your wrinkled pussy, I can't be your lover!"
To the tick tock ya don't stop
To the tick tick ya don't quit

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 29, 2023, 01:12 PMshe'll be past her prime by the next cycle

her beauty is her power and her youth is her beauty

she'll still be fuckable but she'll be a pornhub skip

she's smart and a great speaker and charismatic but so are all of them - her power is big dick energy and that comes from the cunt

you might not wanna believe it but it is like that

Quote from: Mrs. Waffles on May 29, 2023, 05:41 PMI think if we're talking what conservatives value in women, then yeah. But I'd like to think people who would be voting for AOC in the first place wouldn't really give too much of a shit if she's a "Pornhub skip".

I would certainly hope the moderate-to-left-leaning voter base wouldn't see her on the ballot and think "Oh, she's 39 and not as youthfully beautiful (blech) so I'm not voting for her". Do men usually vote with their dicks like that? Maybe I'm out of touch.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 29, 2023, 07:25 PMput her fresh young cunt on the ballot while that pussy is still magic

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 29, 2023, 07:25 PMAOC is sexy af

put her fresh young cunt on the ballot while that pussy is still magic

Quote from: jimmy jazz on May 29, 2023, 10:23 PMThe NonSexual thing didn't last long then.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 29, 2023, 10:45 PMthat was a political exception

and virtuosic penmanship

truth and poetic vulgarity

i'm the heterosexual oscar wilde

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 29, 2023, 01:12 PMshe'll be past her prime by the next cycle

Quote from: Jwb on May 30, 2023, 12:37 AMFuckin mullet headed hillary clinton in her perpetual series  of pantssuits almost got elected.  Nobody is going to convince me that if AOC can't get elected it's cause she's not hot enough.


OH's logic can make sense but only if you assume AOC is being carried largely by sex appeal.

QuoteIf she was a white lady then sure I would agree with you because they tend to age like spoiled milk

Quote from: Jwb on May 30, 2023, 12:50 AMI think at least as much of it is the hard line progressive angle.  I feel like tulsi is just as hot but much more hated by the same crowd.

I also think AOCs politics pose a bigger road block than her looks.  By far.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 30, 2023, 01:04 AMmaybe so but unfortunately for black women black men seem to prefer spoiled milk than perfectly rich chocolate milk

Quote from: SGR on May 30, 2023, 01:10 AMI doubt that's true in general.

Quote from: Jwb on May 30, 2023, 01:25 AMBy racist af you mean they are dating white women?

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 30, 2023, 01:29 AMtheir dicks are white supremacists

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 30, 2023, 01:04 AMmaybe so but unfortunately for black women black men seem to prefer spoiled milk than perfectly rich chocolate milk

there are more "black" babies being born from white mothers than from two black parents

although i think if your mom is white you're white - everyone knows it's a matriarchy when it comes to raising children

but race is a social construct until it's a "black" kid being raised white

Quote from: Toy Revolver on May 30, 2023, 01:06 AMtulsi has NOTHING going for her but her looks though

Quotealso, the whole "if your mom is white, you're white" thing isn't true. There is this thing called the one drop rule. If you have any drop of blood in you from another race or black race specifically. You are no longer "pure" and considered white. You are THAT race. If you are 1/8th black because of a grandpa or grandma. You are essentially black.

QuoteJewish

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jun 01, 2023, 10:05 PMhttps://twitter.com/bennyjohnson/status/1664344646854516738

😂

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jun 01, 2023, 10:05 PMhttps://twitter.com/bennyjohnson/status/1664344646854516738

😂

QuoteBlack women are the least desirable female according to many dating sites/studies

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jun 01, 2023, 11:23 PMI think some mixed race women are nice.

Not black women.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Jun 01, 2023, 11:37 PMall races have sexy women

wtf you talkin bout willis

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jun 01, 2023, 11:52 PMWell yeah you could find an exception to the rule but generally. If you take 1,000 random white women and 1,000 random black women I'm gonna find far more of the white women attractive. Same with desi women.

I don't particularly like East Asians either, they are cute looking but not really sexy.

Quote from: Toy Revolver on Jun 02, 2023, 12:36 AMto each their own but don't be expecting personality stereotypes to be true once you pass the honeymoon phase

Quote from: DJChameleon on May 31, 2023, 11:42 AMalso, the whole "if your mom is white, you're white" thing isn't true. There is this thing called the one drop rule. If you have any drop of blood in you from another race or black race specifically. You are no longer "pure" and considered white. You are THAT race. If you are 1/8th black because of a grandpa or grandma. You are essentially black.

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Jun 04, 2023, 01:03 AMBiden is so pathetic.  What sandbag?

Quote from: SGR on Jun 01, 2023, 10:56 PMWho could've planted that sandbag there?

(https://media1.giphy.com/media/v1.Y2lkPTc5MGI3NjExYmI1OWIzNjdiZTljNjJjYTk1ZTdmNmE4ZTM5NzIyNTA3MDI0Y2IxYSZlcD12MV9pbnRlcm5hbF9naWZzX2dpZklkJmN0PWc/Q802P2hVynigDtkXzN/giphy.gif)

Quote from: Guybrush on Jun 04, 2023, 02:25 AMKamela Anderson is kinda cute.

Is she popular over there?

Quote from: SGR on Jun 05, 2023, 01:46 AMThis won't happen, but imagine if it did. This would be absolutely wild.

Biden's 2024 Hail Mary: Name Barack Obama as His Running Mate? (https://themessenger.com/opinion/bidens-2024-hail-mary-name-barack-obama-as-his-running-mate)

Quote from: Psy-Fi on Jun 05, 2023, 06:41 PMA move like that might be the only way to stop the Republicans from taking back the White House in 2024.

It would be funnier if he threw Kamala under the bus for Michelle Obama, though.

Quote from: TheBig3 on Jun 07, 2023, 04:10 AMAre you people high? Biden is winning non-stop, the GOP is getting hammered all over the place, and you want to remove Dark Brandon?

This comes off as internet contrarianism. Did anyone in the 15 pages me a good argument other than "dude old, lmao"

Quote from: Mrs. Waffles on Apr 27, 2023, 05:27 PMThis thread should be for discussion of our lord and savior, the mighty Dark Brandon.

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Jun 07, 2023, 04:20 AMDude, my sandbag video is the best argument against his reelection you'll ever find.

Quote from: TheBig3 on Jun 07, 2023, 04:59 AMLink?

Quote from: SGR on Jun 04, 2023, 02:34 AM:laughing:

Kamala Harris.

And no, she's not particularly popular, even among the Democratic base.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/approval/kamala-harris/

She's got the charisma of a rusty doorknob. She giggles whenever she's nervous (even if it's inappropriate), and in many of her public appearances/speeches, she comes off like an alcoholic.

I'm not remotely a fan of Biden, but I pray regularly for his good health because if he's out, then she's president.

Quote from: TheBig3 on Jun 08, 2023, 12:32 AMKamala Harris is everything people said Hillary Clinton was, but she wasn't. Hillary Clinton is far more authentic than Kamala Harris. And she doesn't seem to want to be on the policy side of things. I think she's more comfortable on the Judicial side and if the USSJC seat opens they should put her there. Her college repayment plan was a fucking joke. Children could have said "yeah, that ain't gunna sell, lady."

Quote from: SGR on Jun 08, 2023, 02:07 AMI'd rather have Dianne Feinstein there than Kamala.

Quote from: TheBig3 on Jun 08, 2023, 03:03 AM...bruh

At the risk of being gross, I'd still KH a phone call if I were single and on the scene.

Quote from: Psy-Fi on Jun 08, 2023, 12:00 PMLondon Breed is much cuter than Kamala and every bit as incompetent.  :love:

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jun 08, 2023, 01:54 PMThat's a person? Sounds like a fucking beer.

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jun 08, 2023, 02:20 PMShe looks like a champion shot putter or powerlifter.

Its a respectful 'no' from me, sorry.

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jun 08, 2023, 01:54 PMThat's a person? Sounds like a fucking beer.

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jun 08, 2023, 02:20 PMShe looks like a champion shot putter or powerlifter.

Its a respectful 'no' from me, sorry.

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Jun 09, 2023, 06:12 AMHappy Pride Month

(https://imagedelivery.net/9sCnq8t6WEGNay0RAQNdvQ/UUID-cl90fixcg130398vmqyonad4lo3/public)

Quote from: TheBig3 on Jun 07, 2023, 04:10 AMAre you people high? Biden is winning non-stop, the GOP is getting hammered all over the place, and you want to remove Dark Brandon?

This comes off as internet contrarianism. Did anyone in the 15 pages me a good argument other than "dude old, lmao"

Quote from: DJChameleon on Jun 11, 2023, 02:47 PMDude is old though but like also he's just going to win because there is NOONE else. We will see what little weaklings crop up to try to challenge him but there isn't anyone strong enough out there.

Quote from: SGR on Jun 12, 2023, 01:45 AMThe primaries are still quite a ways away. I wouldn't be surprised if some health complication forces Dork Brandon to end his re-election bid. At that point, I think RFK Jr. will be the front runner for the Dems. And if he manages to win the nomination, Trump is royally fucked.

Quote from: SGR on Jun 12, 2023, 01:45 AMThe primaries are still quite a ways away. I wouldn't be surprised if some health complication forces Dork Brandon to end his re-election bid. At that point, I think RFK Jr. will be the front runner for the Dems. And if he manages to win the nomination, Trump is royally fucked.

Quote from: TheBig3 on Jun 08, 2023, 12:32 AMKamala Harris is everything people said Hillary Clinton was, but she wasn't. Hillary Clinton is far more authentic than Kamala Harris. And she doesn't seem to want to be on the policy side of things. I think she's more comfortable on the Judicial side and if the USSJC seat opens they should put her there. Her college repayment plan was a fucking joke. Children could have said "yeah, that ain't gunna sell, lady."

Quote from: DJChameleon on Jun 12, 2023, 08:33 AMRFK Jr.? Who?

Quote from: SGR on Jun 12, 2023, 04:14 PMNephew of JFK, son of RFK. He's really (at least right now) the only other Dem candidate (besides Biden) that's polling in the double digits. The interesting thing with him is that he also polls well (for a Democrat) with Republicans. The idea being that if he does end up as the Dem nominee, there's enough disillusioned Republicans who'd vote for him over Trump. And even if Dems don't agree with everything he says, they're gonna vote for him over Trump too.

https://projects.fivethirtyeight.com/polls/president-primary-d/2024/national/

The same way that he's hoping that Biden has to bow out because of health issues, DeSantis is hoping that Trump decides to bow out, or is forced to because of his precarious legal situation. If everything stays the same as it is now (or close to it), then we're all but assured a Trump/Biden rematch.

Quote from: DJChameleon on Jun 12, 2023, 05:00 PMI want Biden to win and for his health issues to crop up right after he gets on office so we can have the first female president even though Kamala is a shit show.

Quote from: SGR on Jun 12, 2023, 05:10 PMSeriously? You'd want that to happen, even though she's a shit show, just to say we've had the first woman president? Not to mention, if his health issues happen to 'crop up' right after he gets in office, many Americans who voted for him will feel like they were lied to - even if that isn't the case.

Personally, I'd like the first woman president to be one who's nominated and voted to be President, not one who ended up in the position because the sitting president couldn't finish his term. Kamala would be guaranteed to give women a bad rep as President (even if that's unfair to other women). She's got no charisma and she has absolutely god awful communications skills. The first woman president should be someone special and remarkable - Kamala is neither (at least not in a good way). AOC would be a much, much better prospect as first woman president.

Quote from: DJChameleon on Jun 13, 2023, 01:42 AMI'm sure the prospect of her becoming president was in the minds of those that voted for Biden in the first place. They weren't only voting for Biden. She is her own person and despite being a terrible first female president it will still be a memorable moment regardless.

Quote from: jadis on Jun 12, 2023, 02:17 PMI always tell students to never use that word except if you want to refer to the very specific meaning it has in Sartre's thought, because in general it doesn't mean shit. Now in politics the whole point is that words don't mean shit but even so, Hillary Clinton and "authentic" lmao

Quote from: TheBig3 on Jun 13, 2023, 02:26 AMAmazing argument. But what else did I expect from a philosophy major.

At any rate, I said what I said. Hillary Clinton is a lot closer to what she appeared to be than Kamala Harris. No one felt like she was Cincinnatus. She looked like a real estate agent, and was a known policy wonk, and she had a laugh that made thrice-divorced men in pickup trucks punch drywall.

Quote from: Mrs. Waffles on Jun 13, 2023, 12:56 PMI mean frankly I don't think any politicians are authentic, especially at the federal level. They might as well be our robot overlords at this point.

Quote from: jadis on Jun 13, 2023, 09:28 AMMore of a snigger than an "argument" tbh...

I was never a philosophy "major" btw (though one of my two doctoral supervisors was and still is a rather prominent philosopher and it was his clout that got me my first "the guy who teaches Foucault so that we proper serious philosophers don't have to" gigs). But if there's one thing post-Kantian philosophy can teach us is that it's more important or at least more interesting to try establishing the conditions of possibility of any particular argument than adopt this or that position on it. What are the rhetorical, ideological, logical, linguistic factors and underlying assumptions that make a certain utterance appear utterly nonsensical in one context and perfectly natural in another.

I guess that at a certain level of immersion into the US political discourse, talking about Hillary Clinton and "authenticity" makes perfect sense. And that's okay. Others it's bound to make snigger.

Quote from: Jwb on Jun 14, 2023, 06:16 AMMy favorite example of authentic Hillary is when she put on a blaccent to quote poetry like a robotic mullet headed cunt.

QuoteJoe Biden left an audience baffled on Friday night when he ended a speech with his latest gaffe, saying: "God save the Queen".

Uttering a phrase possibly not heard on American soil since about 1776, the US president confused gun safety advocates as he cut off an address in Connecticut.

Mr Biden told the audience at the National Safer Communities Summit in West Hartford that bad weather was heading into the area and therefore he would be unable to shake hands with all the attendees, an interaction known in public relations parlance as a "ropeline".

The US president said: "I will stand in front of each section – no, I really mean it – if you can see the camera they can see you. It is the least consequential part of this whole meeting for you, I promise."

Then just before putting down his microphone, he said: "All right? God save the Queen, man".

Quote from: jadis on Jun 18, 2023, 04:58 PMNever understood how could anyone deny he was past his best mentally already during the 2020 dem primaries... If you want to defeat Trump, how about not to resorting to Trump-level denial of basic reality 

Quote from: Jwb on Jun 19, 2023, 09:15 PMthat was a decision that needed to be made in 2020. Now we're stuck with him whether anyone here likes it or not.  You're living on another planet if you don't think Biden will be the Dem ticket in 24.

Quote from: jadis on Jun 18, 2023, 04:58 PMNever understood how could anyone deny he was past his best mentally already during the 2020 dem primaries... If you want to defeat Trump, how about not to resorting to Trump-level denial of basic reality 

Quote from: DJChameleon on Jun 21, 2023, 11:15 AMYou know why you don't understand it's because you don't live stateside. Biden boiled down to being the lesser of two evils. Even more so it was just like get any person in that wasn't Trump and he just eeked out a slight win. Most people that voted for Biden weren't voting for him. They were voting against Trump and thats it. Of course everyone knows he's an old man on his last legs no one is denying it but it was the best chance to get rid of Trump and it worked.

Quote from: jadis on Jun 21, 2023, 12:47 PM"Understand" is not the word I was looking for. I get the the lesser evil thing, anyone but Trump etc. Moreover, I agree. But I also think that if you start playing fast and loose with reality then you're slipping precariously close to Trump's own turf. And that will end up boomeranging in your face. As could very well happen next year. 

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Jun 21, 2023, 06:31 PMGuess it's time for RFK Jr. 2024

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Jun 21, 2023, 06:31 PMGuess it's time for RFK Jr. 2024

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jun 21, 2023, 01:19 PMYou really think Trump could win? I suppose if he goes against Biden again there's a chance but is Biden really gonna be the democrat candidate?

Quote from: SGR on Jun 21, 2023, 11:31 PMIf I was his father and I was president, and it came down to it, I'd pardon him every time.

Quote from: Guybrush on Jun 22, 2023, 02:28 AMPardoning seems weird sometimes as it breaks with the idea that the law is the same for all people. If you pardon someone, it should be because you believe they're actually innocent. Otherwise, it shows a lack of integrity.

Not saying I wouldn't do it for my kid, though.. Who knows.

Quote from: SGR on Jun 22, 2023, 02:42 AMYeah, that's the thing. It's just an idea or rather, an ideal, It's not actually true in practice. Not in America at least.

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jun 21, 2023, 01:19 PMYou really think Trump could win? I suppose if he goes against Biden again there's a chance but is Biden really gonna be the democrat candidate?

Quote from: Jwb on Jun 23, 2023, 02:52 AMBiden should drop Kamala and make Hunter his vp.

Quote from: Jwb on Jun 23, 2023, 04:21 AMI bet Hunter on a crack binge could have found those 10,000 votes.

Quote from: SGR on Jun 23, 2023, 05:19 AMNote to Democrat operatives: don't hide Republican ballots in hookers' assholes.

Quote from: Psy-Fi on Jun 26, 2023, 02:43 PM'Getting in shape for my debates with President Biden!' (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-12232011/Jake-Tapper-slams-RFK-Jr-wild-false-story-working-together.html)

Quote from: degrassi.knoll on Jul 15, 2023, 12:31 AMI don't understand why they don't just put him in a wheelchair. The cognitive concerns wouldn't be as illuminated without the addition of the stumbles and falls. I think he has to run, don't see the DNC ever backtracking.

Quote from: SGR on Jul 15, 2023, 02:04 AMIf they run him again, that would lose them the election - bad optics.

Quote from: degrassi.knoll on Jul 15, 2023, 02:43 AMNever stopped them before

Quote from: SGR on Jul 15, 2023, 03:01 AMI mean, there's always been incidents with politicians having bad optics, but they're usually one time mistakes that get blown up bigger than they deserve to be by the media- e.g. Dukakis riding in the tank, George H.W. Bush checking his watch during a debate, etc. Putting Biden in a wheelchair and then trying to convince voters that he's the best and strongest candidate the party has to offer would be political suicide. During FDR's admin, they did everything they could to hide from the public that he was crippled.

Quote from: SGR on Jul 14, 2023, 10:00 PMSo who's ready to bet that Biden won't actually run for re-election?

Quote from: Psy-Fi on Jul 15, 2023, 05:59 PMCornel West says Biden committed 'crime against humanity' against black Americans (https://nypost.com/2023/07/15/cornel-west-biden-treatment-of-blacks-crime-against-humanity/)

Quote from: jadis on Jul 15, 2023, 06:17 PMBtw was this prompted by any specific incident, like the child nibbling thing in Finland (https://nypost.com/2023/07/14/joe-biden-creepily-nibbles-childs-shoulder-in-finland/)?

Quote from: jimmy jazz on Jul 15, 2023, 07:12 PMHe must know, or at least must have been told, that people are aware of him being weird around kids and he still does that ???

Quote from: SGR on Jul 14, 2023, 10:00 PMSo who's ready to bet that Biden won't actually run for re-election?

Quote from: Jwb on Jul 18, 2023, 10:08 AMI'll bet you 100 dollars that he is the dem candidate in 24. Without even thinking about it and with no disposable income. That's how confident i am..

Quote from: Jwb on Jul 18, 2023, 10:13 PMWho is it gonna be if not biden lol.  I'll bet you right now bruh don't try to bluff me out it.

Quote from: Jwb on Jul 18, 2023, 11:36 PMI would love to be wrong and have RFK run instead, that would be a lot more fun to watch than biden vs Trump round 2. But I'm not wrong.

Quote from: DJChameleon on Jul 19, 2023, 02:33 AMWhy is everyone propping up RFK? He is a left wing version of Alex Jones!

Quote from: Jwb on Jul 19, 2023, 06:25 AMHe sounds like he survived a gunshot wound to the head tbh. Still more coherent than Marriane Williamson, the crystal worshipping hippy cunt that she is.

Quote from: jadis on Jul 20, 2023, 10:40 AMNo idea but this can mean something like "Americans lead a lifestyle and eat food that sickens them and we should address this in addition to making medical care more affordable"... In which case I agree with her. Also didn't she endorse Bernie after dropping in 2020?

There's something likable about her or at least I've been around people who taught me to see her as likable

Quote from: jadis on Jul 28, 2023, 04:02 PMYep  (https://twitter.com/SevaUT/status/1684906022450720775)

QuoteAt the 1980 Olympics, Brezhnev begins his speech. "O!"—applause. "O!"—an ovation. "O!!!"—the whole audience stands up and applauds. An aide comes running to the podium and whispers, "Leonid Ilyich, those are the Olympic logo rings, you don't need to read all of them!"

Quote from: Psy-Fi on Aug 22, 2023, 02:27 PM'Liar, Liar, Pants on Fire' (https://nypost.com/2023/08/21/biden-tries-to-commiserate-with-maui-survivors-over-small-house-fire/)

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Aug 27, 2023, 03:12 PMI'd pay to see that.

Quote from: Psy-Fi on Aug 27, 2023, 12:36 AMImagine a debate between President Joe Biden and Cornell West.

Quote from: Jwb on Aug 27, 2023, 08:03 PMWhy would he debate a green party candidate?

QuoteThe president has a history of referring to African Americans as "boy" — a term considered a racial epithet when used to describe black men.

Earlier this year, Biden used the word while referring to Maryland's first black governor, Wes Moore.

Quote from: Psy-Fi on Sep 24, 2023, 03:29 PMPresident Biden refers to rapper LL Cool J as 'boy' while speaking to Congressional Black Caucus (https://nypost.com/2023/09/23/president-biden-refers-to-rapper-ll-cool-j-as-boy-while-speaking-to-black-caucus/)

Quote from: Guybrush on Dec 13, 2023, 11:21 PMSigh. Isn't there a presidential candidate who doesn't have dementia, is a career criminal or who eats baby adrenochrome (?) for lunch?

Quote from: Guybrush on Dec 14, 2023, 04:06 PMWhat is that and who does pushups on their knees?

Quote from: Psy-Fi on Dec 15, 2023, 08:29 PMRFK Jr. faces steep hurdles and high costs to get on ballot in all 50 states (https://www.cbsnews.com/news/rfk-jr-ballot-access/)

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Dec 15, 2023, 11:22 PMSee, this is ultimately why people who say "democracy is under threat" are full of it - this very story demonstrates that we don't really have one. Nobody should have to pay tens of millions of dollars to get on the ballots if the polls show that they have significant clout as an option that isn't a big D or R.

Quote from: Nimbly9 on Dec 15, 2023, 11:22 PMSee, this is ultimately why people who say "democracy is under threat" are full of it - this very story demonstrates that we don't really have one. Nobody should have to pay tens of millions of dollars to get on the ballots if the polls show that they have significant clout as an option that isn't a big D or R.

Quote from: Jwb on Dec 18, 2023, 03:32 AMThat would require a constitutional amendment.  And it would clearly favor the democrats and hurt the Republicans.  So there's no way to get the bipartisan consensus necessary for such a measure.

QuoteThe state-by-state winner-take-all method of awarding electoral votes is not in the U.S. Constitution. It was not debated at the Constitutional Convention. It was not discussed in the Federalist Papers.

QuoteThe winner-take-all rule is used today in 48 of the 50 states because it was enacted as a state statute in those states, under the same provision of the U.S. Constitution (empowering the states to choose the method of awarding their electoral votes) being used to enact the National Popular Vote plan.

Quote from: SGR on Feb 09, 2024, 07:30 PMIf Biden is mentally unfit to stand trial, he's mentally unfit to be President (https://www.dailymail.co.uk/columnists/article-13066277/RICHARD-LITTLEJOHN-Biden-mentally-unfit-trial-President.htmlIf%20Biden%20is%20mentally%20unfit%20to%20stand%20trial,%20he's%20mentally%20unfit%20to%20be%20President)

This is a big problem for Dems. GOP is going to pound them over and over about this. I hadn't really thought they'd truly try to replace Biden - I mean I knew it was an outside possibility, but now it's seeming more and more likely.

Quote from: jadis on Feb 15, 2024, 11:55 PMHmmm so who gets in at the convention if Genocide Joe's out?

Quote from: SGR on Feb 22, 2024, 04:08 PM

Quote from: Psy-Fi on Feb 23, 2024, 05:55 PM

DEMS PANIC Over Michigan Voter Israel REVOLT

Quote from: Psy-Fi on Mar 18, 2024, 02:27 PMJoe Biden's new 'boat anchor' shoes meant for maximum 'stability' as president's falls spark concern (https://nypost.com/2024/03/18/us-news/joe-bidens-new-boat-anchor-shoes-meant-for-maximum-stability/)

Quote from: Lisnaholic on Mar 18, 2024, 07:09 PM^ :laughing: Good one, guys!

Here's another ridiculous US President - the guy's in a wheelchair !! :laughing:

(https://www.press.jhu.edu/sites/default/files/covers/9781421442839.jpg)

Quote from: SGR on Mar 18, 2024, 10:47 PMYou have to admit though, if we're being straight, he had a lot more energy than Biden does. Despite being crippled, getting four terms as President, and leading us through the deadliest war in human history, he still had enough time and energy to cheat on his wife with around 5 other women! I'm fully healthy, almost 30, and I can't imagine handling more than one! :laughing: 

Quote from: Guybrush on Mar 19, 2024, 12:37 AMJoseph Stalin has a very friendly smile 😅

Quote from: Lisnaholic on Mar 18, 2024, 11:52 PM^ I had no idea about those extra-marital details SGR! Yeah, pretty impressive in terms of energy. Actually, I don't really know anything about Roosevelt, but he turns up in our history books, of course. I remember learning about the Yalta conference and wondering about this photo: the 3 most powerful men in the world, looking like they've gone to the park together to feed the pigeons:

(https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/commons/thumb/0/05/Yalta_Conference_%28Churchill%2C_Roosevelt%2C_Stalin%29_%28B%26W%29.jpg/1024px-Yalta_Conference_%28Churchill%2C_Roosevelt%2C_Stalin%29_%28B%26W%29.jpg)

Quote from: SGR on Mar 19, 2024, 01:53 PM(https://i0.wp.com/the-past.com/wp-content/uploads/2023/03/post-1_image5-8.jpg?ssl=1)

Stalin was a brutal despot, but to Guy's point, he could be photogenic when he wanted to be.

QuoteAfter taking power in the 1920s, Joseph Stalin killed at least 9 million people through mass murder, forced labor, and famine, but the true figure may be as high as 60 million.

Quote from: Lisnaholic on Mar 19, 2024, 03:24 PM^ That's an interesting photo, SGR, as both leaders appear to be really enjoying each other's company. None the less, I have some advice for you, Guybrush and Winston Churchill:

:band: "Never smile at a crocodile, Don't be taken in by his friendly grin."  :band:

The total figures vary according to the source, but estimates are consistently higher than the 6 million victims of the Holocaust: a horrifying number that many people will be familiar with. The message I take from these two massive tragedies: the European Jews were fatally abandoned during the years of Hitler's regime - but no-one has been more abandoned, more forgotten, than the Russian peasant farmers, or anyone unlucky enough to be labelled "dissident" by Smiling Joe Stalin.

QuoteUnder Lend-Lease, the United States provided more than one-third of all the explosives used by the Soviet Union during the war. The United States and the British Commonwealth provided 55 percent of all the aluminum the Soviet Union used during the war and more than 80 percent of the copper.

Lend-Lease also sent aviation fuel equivalent to 57 percent of what the Soviet Union itself produced. Much of the American fuel was added to lower-grade Soviet fuel to produce the high-octane fuel needed by modern military aircraft.

The Lend-Lease program also provided more than 35,000 radio sets and 32,000 motorcycles. When the war ended, almost 33 percent of all the Red Army's vehicles had been provided through Lend-Lease. More than 20,000 Katyusha mobile multiple-rocket launchers were mounted on the chassis of American Studebaker trucks.

In addition, the Lend-Lease program propped up the Soviet railway system, which played a fundamental role in moving and supplying troops. The program sent nearly 2,000 locomotives and innumerable boxcars to the Soviet Union. In addition, almost half of all the rails used by the Soviet Union during the war came through Lend-Lease.

Quote from: Lisnaholic on Mar 18, 2024, 07:09 PM^ :laughing: Good one, guys!

Here's another ridiculous US President - the guy's in a wheelchair !! :laughing:

(https://www.press.jhu.edu/sites/default/files/covers/9781421442839.jpg)

Quote from: grindy on Mar 19, 2024, 06:12 PMAnd him being in a wheelchair was hidden from the public for a long time through various deceptions, in order to not make him appear weak...

QuoteOver the last century, historians have continued to dig into the proceedings of the Wilson administration and it has become clear that Edith Wilson acted as much more than a mere "steward." She was, essentially, the nation's chief executive until her husband's second term concluded in March of 1921. Nearly three years later, Woodrow Wilson died in his Washington, D.C., home, at 2340 S Street, NW, at 11:15 AM on Sunday, Feb. 3, 1924.

Quote from: SGR on Mar 19, 2024, 04:14 PMOh believe me, I know all too well about the crimes of Stalin and the USSR. When I was in college, I was rather obsessed with Soviet history (and the morbid terror of communism in general). From the great purges, to the gulags, to the Holodomor, to dekulakization, Stalin placed no value on the human life he was eviscerating in an attempt to fast-track industrialization. The Ukraine famine was so bad, residents were resorting to cannibalism. Here's a picture to give you an idea of what was going on - a couple selling human flesh (this picture is from the Povolzhye famine of 1921-1922, but gives you an idea).

'Gore, disturbing'

(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/12/30/12/3BB6B4F200000578-0-image-a-22_1483101155805.jpg)

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Despite the insane cost of human life, Stalin and the Soviets still weren't industrialized enough to handle the war effort against the nazis on their own. In American schools and popular American media, we often overstate how important our direct military involvement was in WW2 - while in Russian schools, they tend to downplay the contributions from America in terms of how important we were to winning the war. In reality, one of the most important US contributions came through the Lend-Lease act (https://www.rferl.org/a/did-us-lend-lease-aid-tip-the-balance-in-soviet-fight-against-nazi-germany/30599486.html), in which we provided the Soviets with a boatload of military equipment and raw materials:

The link I provided also contains some quotes from Stalin and Khrushchev confirming their belief that without US aid, they wouldn't have been able to win the war. Put morbidly, America provided the Soviets the machines, and the Soviets provided the meat to use them.

If anyone is interested, this is probably the most extensive and detailed book I've read if you're just interested in morbidly awful things that happened in many Communist regimes:

(https://di2ponv0v5otw.cloudfront.net/posts/2023/02/11/63e89368f8c5dadc25480d2a/m_63e8937beb7e7a253aca5c8f.jpg)

Quote

A vote for Trump means:-

(https://assets.rebelmouse.io/eyJhbGciOiJIUzI1NiIsInR5cCI6IkpXVCJ9.eyJpbWFnZSI6Imh0dHBzOi8vYXNzZXRzLnJibC5tcy81MTY4MzI4NC9vcmlnaW4ucG5nIiwiZXhwaXJlc19hdCI6MTc2MDA4ODU2NX0.lZLUEda-B-OHGTOVCIRQ94dETiiKb_jhI1VQOivjwj4/img.png?width=400&height=209)
"Welcome home, Honey ! I've just made some apple pie"

Vote for Biden and his communist policies and America will become:-

'Gore, disturbing'

(https://i.dailymail.co.uk/i/pix/2016/12/30/12/3BB6B4F200000578-0-image-a-22_1483101155805.jpg)

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I am Majorie Taylor Greene and I approve this message.

Quote from: Lexi Darling on Mar 20, 2024, 07:20 PMI saw that video. It's so freaky that the "wholesome suburban mom in the kitchen" angle is what they're running with. I mean, I wouldn't ever want to promote being me to anyone, let alone all of America.  :laughing:

Quote from: DJChameleon on Mar 20, 2024, 07:56 PMTrad con movement has been growing lately and it seems like a trendy thing but there are trad con men and women on social media like gaining popularity lately.