Quote
PBS NewsHour
Apr 10, 2025
spoiler: they're going to say it's vaccines
FUCKING EUGENECISTS NAZIS NEED TO FUCKING OFF THEMSELVES FOR THE GOOD OF HUMANITY NO BRAIN IS LESSER FUCK YOURSELF IF YOU ARE A NAZI KILL YOUR FUCKING SELF FUCK
the opposite of autism is assimilation and that is what makes neurotypicals what they are fuck I am seething angry fuck this world they want everyone to be devoid of personality and submit mindlessly to labor forever and make fuckers richer I cannot fucking stand nazi fucks GOD FUCKING DAMN my autism is not a problem to be solved and if you think it is then you should fucking take a knife to your goddamn throat you white supremacist nazi fuck
also I'm not ranting at anyone here (I hope) I'm ranting at the trump administration and their progressively thinly veiled 1488 bullshit
I think the autism topic is just a large lack of education and knowledge about it, and the pattern, lol, seems to be with people who lack knowledge on most topics.
bottom line, the increase in autism numbers over the past decades isn't rocket science ;)
it is the same with any other diagnostics, way better detection now has created the ability to find it earlier
the DSM 6, when that releases will be interesting to see if the criteria has changed
Quote from: tristan_geoff on Apr 11, 2025, 05:08 PMFUCKING EUGENECISTS NAZIS NEED TO FUCKING OFF THEMSELVES FOR THE GOOD OF HUMANITY NO BRAIN IS LESSER FUCK YOURSELF IF YOU ARE A NAZI KILL YOUR FUCKING SELF FUCK
Quote from: tristan_geoff on Apr 11, 2025, 05:09 PMthe opposite of autism is assimilation and that is what makes neurotypicals what they are fuck I am seething angry fuck this world they want everyone to be devoid of personality and submit mindlessly to labor forever and make fuckers richer I cannot fucking stand nazi fucks GOD FUCKING DAMN my autism is not a problem to be solved and if you think it is then you should fucking take a knife to your goddamn throat you white supremacist nazi fuck
Not sure what you're going for here but it isn't a good look.
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 11, 2025, 08:57 PMNot sure what you're going for here but it isn't a good look.
Aspergers and the ranking of intelligence levels is straight out of the nazi playbook with eugenics, I've spent my whole life being told I'm slow and stupid and all this shit because of my neurotype. I'm enough, every autistic person is enough, what we think and feel is valuable and our personal experience. There is no cure for autism as much as there's a cure for being human, and good. I love being autistic, plenty of people do and would moreso if we didn't live in an oppressive world built for people that are able to desensitize and compartmentalize reality into symbolism as a means to an end.
Tolerating people who think that people are less worthy by means of some difference in intelligence is where racism, sexism, ableism stem from, and tolerating people like this is no better than being one yourself.
I will tell a nazi to their goddamn face to kill themselves and I am not ashamed of it. If they aren't gonna not be a nazi they better at least give the people trying to escape suffering the oxygen they're wasting.
I'm tired of having to try so hard and prove myself to people, yes I was upset when I wrote that, no I don't take it back. Nazis should commit suicide end of story. I'm allowed to say that too, no backsies. Try to police my tone when I'm upset about something you know nothing about too while your at it?
lol
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 11, 2025, 09:16 PMlol
I'm tired of callous people dismissing autistic people's emotions. If you don't care say that.
Fuck retards right?
Quote from: tristan_geoff on Apr 11, 2025, 09:18 PMI'm tired of callous people dismissing autistic people's emotions. If you don't care say that.
No I just think those posts don't do you any favours.
I agree with Tristan that Nazis all need to follow their leader. If that does me no favors in your mind, I dunno what to say I guess.
Not sure why you think an autistic person venting about the treatment of her people and the links that treatment has to eugenicist policies (Hans Asperger, who codified the diagnosis, was a Nazi after all) "isn't a good look". I don't see how Tristan's anger isn't perfectly understandable when it's being directed at fucking Nazis.
Quote from: Lexi Darling on Apr 11, 2025, 11:32 PMI agree with Tristan that Nazis all need to follow their leader. If that does me no favors in your mind, I dunno what to say I guess.
Not sure why you think an autistic person venting about the treatment of her people and the links that treatment has to eugenicist policies (Hans Asperger, who codified the diagnosis, was a Nazi after all) "isn't a good look". I don't see how Tristan's anger isn't perfectly understandable when it's being directed at fucking Nazis.
Don't try and word it like my issue is with autism.
And RFK Jr isn't a Nazi. You throw that word around like confetti.
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 11, 2025, 11:57 PMDon't try and word it like my issue is with autism.
And RFK Jr isn't a Nazi. You throw that word around like confetti.
I didn't say I thought your issue was with autism and i don't know how you got that from my post.
I also never said RFK was a nazi.
Quote from: Lexi Darling on Apr 12, 2025, 12:11 AMI didn't say I thought your issue was with autism and i don't know how you got that from my post.
I also never said RFK was a nazi.
Got it right here:
"Not sure why you think an autistic person"
You implied that was my issue.
Who is in the video in the OP? RFK Jr. If you and Tristan are not saying he's a Nazi then why go on a rant about Nazis?
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 12, 2025, 12:21 AMGot it right here:
"Not sure why you think an autistic person"
You implied that was my issue.
Who is in the video in the OP? RFK Jr. If you and Tristan are not saying he's a Nazi then why go on a rant about Nazis?
I was pointing out that your issue was with the vent post made by the autistic person in question (Tristan), not that I thought your issue was with autism itself. And I think autistic people have every right to vent about how their government is treating them.
And most of the conversation was about the eugenicist policies that the Nazis and RFK both happen to espouse. Whether RFK literally identifies as a Nazi is irrelevant, the point Tristan was making was that his attitude toward autistic people is directly rooted in the eugenicist rhetoric of the Nazis with regards to autism. As I said, the person who is most responsible for the modern right's perception of autism was Nazi Hans Asperger.
Quote from: Lexi Darling on Apr 12, 2025, 12:26 AMI was pointing out that your issue was with the vent post made by the autistic person in question (Tristan), not that I thought your issue was with autism itself. And I think autistic people have every right to vent about how their government is treating them.
And most of the conversation was about the eugenicist policies that the Nazis and RFK both happen to espouse. Whether RFK literally identifies as a Nazi is irrelevant, the point Tristan was making was that his attitude toward autistic people is directly rooted in the eugenicist rhetoric of the Nazis with regards to autism. As I said, the person who is most responsible for the modern right's perception of autism was Nazi Hans Asperger.
There was really no need to mention his being autistic unless trying to make a point about it being the reason why I posted.
It is once again accusing everyone of being a Nazi. I'll probably be accused of it now.
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 12, 2025, 12:35 AMThere was really no need to mention his being autistic unless trying to make a point about it being the reason why I posted.
It is once again accusing everyone of being a Nazi. I'll probably be accused of it now.
She was making a point about how RFK's views on autism are rooted in the Nazi eugenicist views on autism, I don't know why you're not understanding this
Quote from: Lexi Darling on Apr 12, 2025, 12:37 AMShe was making a point about how RFK's views on autism are rooted in the Nazi eugenicist views on autism, I don't know why you're not understanding this
That is a stretch but OK.
ITT someone who hasn't done their history homework defending fascism with tooth and nail
Quote from: tristan_geoff on Apr 12, 2025, 01:06 AMITT someone who hasn't done their history homework defending fascism with tooth and nail
I haven't defended fascism 😂
I never said I agreed with anything in the video, I never said anything about autism once.
Posts like that are why I end up commenting.
ITT: "Look at how stupid and wrong the other argument is anything I say cannot be backed up or analyzed too strongly or it is tryhard"
https://journal.media-culture.org.au/index.php/mcjournal/article/view/1655
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 12, 2025, 01:11 AMI never said anything about autism once.
You're ridiculing an autistic person who knows more about it, its historical link between the establishment of the diagnosis and fascist eugenics, and the struggles and stigmas autistic people face than you do. And you've been repeatedly unwilling to elaborate on the reason you were mocking her in the first place.
You don't have to say anything explicitly about autism to give off an air of flippant ignorance toward the posts on the subject that Tristan was making.
Quote from: Lexi Darling on Apr 12, 2025, 01:22 AMYou're ridiculing an autistic person who knows more about it, its historical link between the establishment of the diagnosis and fascist eugenics, and the struggles and stigmas autistic people face than you do. And you've been repeatedly unwilling to elaborate on the reason you were mocking her in the first place.
You don't have to say anything explicitly about autism to give off an air of flippant ignorance toward what Tristan was talking about.
There you go again trying to make out I have a problem with autistic people.
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 12, 2025, 01:27 AMThere you go again trying to make out I have a problem with autistic people.
I said you were ridiculing an autistic person and had a flippant, dismissive response to her speaking about her experience as an autistic person, not that you have a problem with autistic people. Those are two different sentences and you know it.
Quote from: Lexi Darling on Apr 12, 2025, 01:29 AMI said you were ridiculing an autistic person and had a flippant, dismissive response to her speaking about her experience as an autistic person, not that you have a problem with autistic people. Those are two different sentences and you know it.
By constantly saying "ridiculing an autistic person" and emphasising the person has autism you're implying I have an issue with them because of their autism. You know full well what you're doing.
Next you'll be saying I've banned autistic people from entering the thread.
It wasn't about Tristan having autism in and of itself. For the third time I do not think you have anti-autistic views. She went on a passionate vent that was relevant to the subject of this thread and her experiences and views on it as an autistic person. That's what you clearly think is worthy of mockery, not her intrinsic status as an autistic person. I'm not saying you hate autistic people, I'm saying your "lol" posts were really tone deaf.
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 11, 2025, 08:57 PMNot sure what you're going for here but it isn't a good look.
And this isn't a good look for you. Equality amirite
FYI, from the point of at least one mod I see nothing wrong with Tristan's rant. If someone looks at that video, is autisic and is triggered by what's said in it, they have a perfect right to go on a rant. I think the Trump administration taken as one big, steaming, smelly, hot mess has long ago forfeited the right to be treated with any sort of nuance or understanding. What did that fella in the Bible say? Long hair, beard, was into woodwork? Do unto others? Well can you hear the sound of chickens coming home to roost?
Speaking as mod and co-creator of SCD, and speaking as (allegedly) a human being, I refute JJ's claim that the rant is "not a good look". It's perfectly fine and understandable. What would probably not be a good look would be for someone genuinely upset by that video NOT to rant.
There's a disturbing current of nitpicking and "prove it" in your posts lately, JJ. I tackled you on it in the Trump thread. Let's be quite honest: with the world as it is now, being a nitpicker and all but apologist for the Trump administration is not a good look for you. You may feel that's an unfair characterisation of you, but I'm pretty certain there are at least three people here who would agree with me. You don't tend to add anything to conversations/threads/debates involving the latest atrocity wrought by Project 2025, other than to try to either deny it or force someone to prove a point. It really would be better for you not to comment on such sensitive issues if you don't have the sensitivity to do so. People are hurting, and you're just not helping, mate. I hope you can see where I'm coming from here. I would say it's not a criticism, but it really is. You might be better just metaphorically biting your tongue rather than challenging people on small points of semantics when these people are oppressed and scared and angry enough already. Or just try to be more understanding and sympathetic.
Edited to add: the words "Trump administration" and "eliminate" are a chilling combination in almost every case.
Not to dogpile or repeat what Trollheart has already said, but I also didn't see anything at all wrong with Tristan's posts. There's a lot of people who are rightfully concerned and angry about how things are going and what it means for them, and there's also less and less places to openly express that without it painting targets on their backs. Let's not be one of those places. If you can't relate to that and you are safe and secure in your station in life with everything going on and are looking around thinking "what are all of these people on about", count your blessings, and I hope things stay well for you.
Beyond playing games with minutia and semantics, these simple "lol" replies to thought out responses only serve to agitate and dismiss without actually making a point. Whether that's your intent or not, that's the outcome. Instead of picking at these things looking for any little hole, maybe try engaging with the larger reasons for why people are worried and pissed off. Try to understand from their perspective. You learn more from listening than from trying to poke holes. If you simply can't help yourself from doing that, there's more than enough places online where you can get pats on the back for this sort of thing. Not sure if that will happen here, and I don't perceive much appetite from the posters here to entertain martyr routines when pushback comes.
The "lol" style replies are so tiresome. There's always a productive way to have back and forth conversations about political things, but the nature of the internet doesn't allow for it. Its basically a reddit form of communication and it's exhausting. People want reactions more than they want to have an actual conversation. And it's only getting worse.
Keep in mind that the Kanye West thread is one of the more popular threads on this forum despite Kanye's views. Speaks volumes.
Quote from: Trollheart on Apr 12, 2025, 03:14 AMThere's a disturbing current of nitpicking and "prove it" in your posts lately, JJ. I tackled you on it in the Trump thread. Let's be quite honest: with the world as it is now, being a nitpicker and all but apologist for the Trump administration is not a good look for you. You may feel that's an unfair characterisation of you, but I'm pretty certain there are at least three people here who would agree with me. You don't tend to add anything to conversations/threads/debates involving the latest atrocity wrought by Project 2025, other than to try to either deny it or force someone to prove a point. It really would be better for you not to comment on such sensitive issues if you don't have the sensitivity to do so. People are hurting, and you're just not helping, mate. I hope you can see where I'm coming from here. I would say it's not a criticism, but it really is. You might be better just metaphorically biting your tongue rather than challenging people on small points of semantics when these people are oppressed and scared and angry enough already. Or just try to be more understanding and sympathetic.
Well yeah that's because the vast majority of posters on here are far left, they would agree with any post that strays from that position = defending fascism, Trump apologist, or being accused of being uncaring. I generally tend to agree with the views, just not how they're sensationalised.
I've already been biting my tongue. Every now and then something gets posted that is so unbelievable I think, surely that can't be happening. Then you look into it and find that it isn't happening ::) and yes if you post an article or make a bold claim you should prove it if you're asked about it. That's part of having a discussion. You lot just don't like it when someone doesn't agree with 100% of what you're saying. Asking for someone to back up what they've said is not Trump apologism.
If I had posted articles or opinions where there was a nugget of truth in them but they were misleading, you lot would have been on me quicker than flies on shit regardless of whether I was hurting, concerned or had a legitimate grievance.
Just out of interest, if we had a Trump voter on here, and they were open about the fact they voted for Trump, how would they be treated?
Quote from: Auroras In Ice on Apr 12, 2025, 05:42 AMNot to dogpile or repeat what Trollheart has already said, but I also didn't see anything at all wrong with Tristan's posts. There's a lot of people who are rightfully concerned and angry about how things are going and what it means for them
I think it went a bit further than being "rightfully concerned".
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 12, 2025, 11:09 AMWell yeah that's because the vast majority of posters on here are far left, they would agree with any post that strays from that position = defending fascism, Trump apologist, or being accused of being uncaring. I generally tend to agree with the views, just not how they're sensationalised.
I've already been biting my tongue. Every now and then something gets posted that is so unbelievable I think, surely that can't be happening. Then you look into it and find that it isn't happening ::) and yes if you post an article or make a bold claim you should prove it if you're asked about it. That's part of having a discussion. You lot just don't like it when someone doesn't agree with 100% of what you're saying. Asking for someone to back up what they've said is not Trump apologism.
If I had posted articles or opinions where there was a nugget of truth in them but they were misleading, you lot would have been on me quicker than flies on shit regardless of whether I was hurting, concerned or had a legitimate grievance.
Just out of interest, if we had a Trump voter on here, and they were open about the fact they voted for Trump, how would they be treated?
Dude, just stop while you're behind. It's not a good look. You know what you're doing. Best to let it go and move on.
Quote from: Key on Apr 12, 2025, 11:13 AMDude, just stop while you're behind. It's not a good look.
Nothing wrong with what I've posted. As I said, you just don't like it when people don't agree with 100% of your views.
QuoteYou know what you're doing. Best to let it go and move on.
You posted, why don't you move on?
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 12, 2025, 11:16 AMNothing wrong with what I've posted. As I said, you just don't like it when people don't agree with 100% of your views.
You posted, why don't you move on?
If you read this thread, you'd know it's nothing to do with your views. It's about ridiculing someone that shared their opinion about something and them getting attacked for it for seeminly no reason or justification. Just stop.
Quote from: Key on Apr 12, 2025, 11:21 AMIf you read this thread, you'd know it's nothing to do with your views. It's about ridiculing someone that shared their opinion about something and them getting attacked for it for seeminly no reason or justification. Just stop.
Yes it is, Trolls wasn't just talking about this thread. And as far as attacks go, if that was an attack then it was extremely mild.
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 12, 2025, 11:25 AMYes it is, Trolls wasn't just talking about this thread. And as far as attacks go, if that was an attack then it was extremely mild.
Fair enough. I generally don't really have a problem with you or anyone at this forum really. I haven't really read anything in terms of your views that would make me think of you any differently than anyone else so if there's context that im missing, then thats that I suppose.
I think a lot of what's going on in this country has a lot of people rightfully emotional and high strung and that in itself can breed it's own form of angst, if you will. I generally stay out of political discussion for that reason because while a lot of what people are saying is valid, there's a lot of emotional context to it that can't be expressed through text and I think that's generally lost in respect to forums which can make it difficult to have one on one discussions about this kind of stuff.
its not ur values it urs morals honey
Quote from: Key on Apr 12, 2025, 11:35 AMFair enough. I generally don't really have a problem with you or anyone at this forum really. I haven't really read anything in terms of your views that would make me think of you any differently than anyone else so if there's context that im missing, then thats that I suppose.
The thread we're discussing, I said the extra loophole was harsh, stupid and unfair. This is what I mean when I say I generally agree with the view. I didn't say the extra difficulty applying for a visa was justified. I didn't say I agreed with it or supported it. I actually made it clear that I DIDN'T agree with it, but even that isn't enough. What I took issue with was the idea that trans people are now denied entry to the USA. I am absolutely not apologising for that.
QuoteI think a lot of what's going on in this country has a lot of people rightfully emotional and high strung and that in itself can breed it's own form of angst, if you will. I generally stay out of political discussion for that reason because while a lot of what people are saying is valid, there's a lot of emotional context to it that can't be expressed through text and I think that's generally lost in respect to forums which can make it difficult to have one on one discussions about this kind of stuff.
I understand that and that's fair. But it is a discussion forum and if you're going to discuss these issues on here then you have to accept differing opinions.
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 12, 2025, 11:59 AMThe thread we're discussing, I said the extra loophole was harsh, stupid and unfair. This is what I mean when I say I generally agree with the view. I didn't say the extra difficulty applying for a visa was justified. I didn't say I agreed with it or supported it. I actually made it clear that I DIDN'T agree with it, but even that isn't enough. What I took issue with was the idea that trans people are now denied entry to the USA. I am absolutely not apologising for that.
I understand that and that's fair. But it is a discussion forum and if you're going to discuss these issues on here then you have to accept differing opinions.
eugenics is not a fucking opinion, mate
Quote from: tristan_geoff on Apr 12, 2025, 12:02 PMeugenics is not a fucking opinion, mate
It's a good job I didn't say I agreed with it then.
We of course don't police what convictions, beliefs, political leanings or moral values people have, only how they're expressed. I don't think echo chambers are particularly interesting and so I welcome opinions that differ from my own.
In a world that's this polarized, navigating and discussing these topics in a flawless, civil manner isn't easy and sometimes perhaps not even entirely possible, but I do appreciate you all trying.
Despite being on opposite sides of an issue, I urge you to not immediately think the worst of each other. Most of us are probably more moderate in our opinions than a sensationalist media that tries to frighten us would have us believe.
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 12, 2025, 11:59 AMI understand that and that's fair. But it is a discussion forum and if you're going to discuss these issues on here then you have to accept differing opinions.
100%. That's generally why I stay out of these topics. I've always had a problem with being able to convey myself through text properly. I never quite get the point across that I want to get across so I just kind of stay out of this stuff. But I respect those that can do it, and can do it well.
The point here is that, whatever you think, when someone clearly says STOP, then you should stop. You don't keep poking with a stick to see if you can get a reaction. It's about consent really, and once it's clear the consent (to have a debate/argument/fight/discussion/delete as appropriate) is revoked, then both people should pull back. Constantly ribbing people who clearly are not impressed does nobody any favours. You may prove a point, perhaps, but you're in danger of losing people's respect and of putting others in a difficult position. Jesus again: think about your actions and ask yourself what would you do in their place?
Oh, and to answer your question, JJ: anyone clearly identifying as a Trump supporter would not be refused membership or anything, but given the hateful and untrue rhetoric the administration is putting about, they would need to understand that they would have to behave, or would be responded to accordingly. As a pure off the top of my head example, let's say a Trump supporter came here saying WE WON IN 2020, there is no way that would be allowed to stand without a lot of heated debate. There may be Trump/MAGAs who can debate seriously and politely and respectfully, but if they can't, then we'd have to look at the whole issue. We're not about to allow this place to become a sounding board for Trump, not when so many people here are being oppressed by his government.
Quote from: jimmy jazz on Apr 12, 2025, 11:59 AMThe thread we're discussing, I said the extra loophole was harsh, stupid and unfair. This is what I mean when I say I generally agree with the view. I didn't say the extra difficulty applying for a visa was justified. I didn't say I agreed with it or supported it. I actually made it clear that I DIDN'T agree with it, but even that isn't enough. What I took issue with was the idea that trans people are now denied entry to the USA. I am absolutely not apologising for that.
I don't think you should apologize either, I think you got hung up on the semantics of the wording of the headline and jumped to assuming something I don't think the article was implying. I think you're jumping to assuming the most extreme of anyone on a different side of the political spectrum as you. I'm guilty of that too sometimes, and I try to check myself on it and back off and self reflect on my potential biases. I think maybe you need to do that more often.
With regards to the trans thread, I have done nothing if not provide backing and reasoning for my claims; you were ignoring them and instead shifting focus to debating these rigid statements I wasn't even saying. I explained why the visa denial is a deterrent for trans people to enter the country to the point where the amount of hoops to jump through makes it probably not worth it to try to come to America (thus the policy accomplishing its goal) and the first thing you can say is to get defensive and say "well actually technically it's not a total ban" when neither I nor the article was saying that. It was saying that people's visas are being denied because they're trans, rendering them unable to enter the US for as long as they have a correct gender ID. Nothing more, nothing less. You jumped to assuming the most extreme reading possible of the article's headline, the only person sensationalizing anything was you.
And for the record, I am absolutely not "far left" by any metric and I'm sure anyone who is in regular communication with me outside of this forum will back me up on this lol. I don't think you're a Trump supporter, if you say you're not then I take you at your word. I think you are overly quick to make assumptions about the intentions of people on other sides of the political spectrum and you jump in to make some bizarrely presumptive statements on things you don't actually know anything about. Did you even research the process and logistics of a gender marker change in Canada before you shared your assertion on trans Canadians' options for entering the US? It feels like you're speaking over people who actually went through that process of changing gender marker and know the logistics of it.
When someone is airing their frustration about a policy that negatively affects them, it's unhelpful to come in and tell them about how much you think they're being sensationalist. And then doubling down when you have the nuances explained to you.
For the record, I do feel like if you make a thread or a post, you have consented to people replying to you in accordance with the rules. If you regret that decision, the onus should be on you to simply drop it and not engage further. If people continue posting and you find it troublesome, consider asking a mod to lock the thread.
In a perfect world, we respect each other despite differences of opinions and value the interesting discussion that can rise from that. It's ambitious and a difficult balance, but one I hope we can strive towards.
I'm not sure I understand this. Are you saying that Tristan and Lexi should not have responded, and let JJ snark all over their thread? Cos, you know, I don't think that's right or helpful. That seems a little like victim blaming to me. I assume I took that up wrong, but maybe you might set me right.
Technically it's Mindy's thread, but either way my view is that the difference of opinion was not the problem here, but the way those opinions were expressed. In Jimmy's case I thought his disagreement with Tristan's posts was expressed in a very rude and mocking way and did not invite discussion or address any of the matters Tristan was talking about. Snide remarks don't qualify as interesting discussion imo.
I am of the mind that we should all work together to cultivate an environment where we can emphasize engaging in conversations, so I agree with your core point, Guybrush. I personally think being rude and dismissive toward other members while not contributing much if at all to the actual discussion being had is antithetical to that environment. I think we should all encourage fruitful discussion here and have some degree of etiquette toward each other.
Quote from: Lexi Darling on Apr 13, 2025, 08:00 PMIn Jimmy's case I thought his disagreement with Tristan's posts was expressed in a very rude and mocking way and did not invite discussion or address any of the matters Tristan was talking about. Snide remarks don't qualify as interesting discussion imo.
Why didn't you say anything to Tristan when she did it to me then?
https://scd.community/index.php?msg=37017
That wasn't the only post in that thread either.
No doubt you'll defend that and say it was different when Tristan did it.
I don't see any correlation. You had one opinion, Tristan disagreed, you discussed. Whether or not you came to any accommodation I can't say right now as I don't have the time to read the whole discussion. But in this thread your response to her, which was uninvited, was a snide smart remark which you then doubled down on. Show me how that equates to the example you posted, cos I don't see it.
And ideally, stop calling everyone who disagrees with you or has different views "left" - that's not something you know, and only telegraphs the idea that you're very much of the other persuasion. Only those on the right keep trying to demonise those they see as on the left.
Also, incidentally, since you bring it up in the thread, and to use your own tactics, can you post examples of "those on the right" condemning Jan 6th? Cos I ain't seen a single one who wasn't crowing about it and calling it a day of liberation etc. Maybe I just missed that, so if you could point me in that direction?
Okay, I've taken the time to read through from that post on to the end of the thread. First, FYI, I personally called Tristan out here https://scd.community/index.php?msg=36983 not against you but because I disagreed with what they said. So if you think I'm being biased or taking one side against the other, that should show I am, at the very least, an equal opportunities asshole. Second, the rest of your posts in that thread simply conform to and confirm your "left are scum/right are not so bad when you get to know them" mantra which is blatantly untrue. It's just more of the same shit, trying to absolve (some of/most of/the majority of) the right while painting all those you see as being on the left with the one pretty ignorant brush.
I don't see how that helps your cause at all.
I did not discuss anything with Tristan until after that. It started with that snarky comment. There is no difference whatsoever.
QuoteAnd ideally, stop calling everyone who disagrees with you or has different views "left" - that's not something you know, and only telegraphs the idea that you're very much of the other persuasion. Only those on the right keep trying to demonise those they see as on the left.
Yet it's fine for people to call me a right winger when they disagree with me (I am not a right winger). Also I did not say everyone who disagrees with me is left. You've completely made that up.
https://www.pbs.org/newshour/politics/one-year-ago-republicans-condemned-jan-6-insurrection-yesterday-their-response-was-far-more-muted
I await the next moving of the goalposts.
QuoteSecond, the rest of your posts in that thread simply conform to and confirm your "left are scum/right are not so bad when you get to know them" mantra which is blatantly untrue.
Not what I said at all.
Honestly this place is a boring echo chamber where the only confrontation to be had is in the form of these kinds of petty disputes. We need some proper Trump supporters to join. If you disagree with that, I hate you and I hope you're sent to a FEMA camp.
This is just getting ridiculous at this point. Tristan hasn't responded in quite some time so maybe best to push this into private messages and resolve the matter so this thread doesn't become a constant back and forth battle.
Quote from: Trollheart on Apr 13, 2025, 06:56 PMI'm not sure I understand this. Are you saying that Tristan and Lexi should not have responded, and let JJ snark all over their thread? Cos, you know, I don't think that's right or helpful. That seems a little like victim blaming to me. I assume I took that up wrong, but maybe you might set me right.
I'm not really addressing this, but giving just a little pushback on what you wrote about consent. I think posting on a forum is, by its nature, inviting others to reply. If you share a site with people on opposite sides of an issue, that means you're also inviting them to respond. Naturally, they might write something you don't agree with, but.. you also invited them to do just that when you made your post.
Retracting this consent is something you can try, but.. these situations likely won't happen until there's some level of conflict involved and in that state, how often would people comply? Put into system, it seems to me like it could increase conflict by introducing expectations that won't be met (that someone stop posting) and generate more grounds for accusations (why didn't you stop when I retracted my consent?).
I know we provide a place where people from opposite sides of an argument can discuss things. The political discussion between SGR and Lisnaholic is such a great example of this. What I'm less sure of is whether we're providing a safe space for people to vent where they can
expect to make posts and not have people on opposite sides of the issue write replies. I don't think this is something we provide, at least not until we're a full blown echo chamber and I think that would be worse and less interesting overall. So I think you can try to safely vent here, but your peace may be disturbed.
Sometimes, the best thing is to adapt to the environment instead of expecting the environment to adapt to you. If a topic is too depressing or unpleasant, then consider not engaging with it. If someone makes a post that is not breaking the rules, but you think it's a stinker and not worth your time, consider ignoring it. If you want a place to vent where no one from the opposite side of the issue will disturb you, consider doing it on the discord or someplace else that's a little more like an echo chamber.
I consider myself left and largely stay out of these discussions because I find them frustrating, but I still think we have to find the right balance so this place hopefully doesn't become just another echo chamber on the internet. The diversity of our community is part what makes us special, I think. Being able to connect across these differences is a beautiful thing. To preserve this, we gotta be a little careful that we don't cater to one side of an issue, but rather to principles that apply to all equally.
About the going-ons in this thread, there was some nastiness early on that shouldn't have occurred (like merely replying with lol). My reason for posting the above wasn't to address this, but comes in part from a wish to not completely alienate people of moderate or more right leaning political views.
Hey look, I'm happy to leave it at that, but if more snarky comments are posted for no reason, by anyone, which fail to take into account how damaging or hurtful they may be to another poster, then I'll continue to call them out. I don't want real conflict here, and I certainly don't want to be picking on anyone, but we do have rules and if posts begin to escalate into what could be termed personal attacks, I'll address them. I'm not looking to stifle comment or discussion either, but there has to be an understanding that, as has been said before, on the other side of these keyboards and mice and fingers, behind the phones and the computers and the usernames and internet identities are real people, some of whom are hurting in a very real way, and I just think trivialising or making fun of, or even questioning their pain is not the way we should be behaving.
If I went too harsh with JJ and seemed to attack him, then I'm not immune from criticism, and I was once wrong, in December of 1989 I think, so I'm no better than most. But with the way the world is now, the way the internet is going and the way human dignity is being attacked and a really dark cloud is descending over us, I think we all need to be more tolerant and supportive of each other.
And that includes me.
So apologies JJ; didn't mean to attack you and if I did that was wrong, but I hope we won't see any more of this kind of behaviour. Nobody needs it and really, what purpose does it serve?
Quote from: Key on Apr 14, 2025, 01:54 AMThis is just getting ridiculous at this point. Tristan hasn't responded in quite some time so maybe best to push this into private messages and resolve the matter so this thread doesn't become a constant back and forth battle.
Incidentally, just so you know, I wasn't saying anything more but JJ asked a question which I then responded to. Part of that response was that I hadn't read through the thread he referenced, so my second response was that I had read it and that was what I thought. I wasn't trying to bring the issue back up, just responding.
Quote from: Trollheart on Apr 14, 2025, 03:37 PMIncidentally, just so you know, I wasn't saying anything more but JJ asked a question which I then responded to. Part of that response was that I hadn't read through the thread he referenced, so my second response was that I had read it and that was what I thought. I wasn't trying to bring the issue back up, just responding.
Oh I've no doubt that everything everyone was saying here was meant to be helpful. I just think at some point we start to go in circles and end up just repeating the same thing over and over again. And solely due to the fact that Tristan herself hasn't responded in quite some time, I think that's our que to move on from this and hopefully those involved will practice restraint lest we find ourselves in a situation like this again.
Quote from: Key on Apr 14, 2025, 03:56 PMOh I've no doubt that everything everyone was saying here was meant to be helpful. I just think at some point we start to go in circles and end up just repeating the same thing over and over again. And solely due to the fact that Tristan herself hasn't responded in quite some time, I think that's our que to move on from this and hopefully those involved will practice restraint lest we find ourselves in a situation like this again.
i think progressively different points have been made, i dont see a reason to quell discussion happening naturally on solely my account. trust me i've been reading lol, i agree with most of the points said by trollheart and guybrush.
i feel that anger is an important emotion to learn what is important to you, but pushed in an unprocessed form onto people only muddles whatever point is trying to come forth.
that being said, i appreciate that there are people here on very different ends of the political spectrum, i think that no matter what you think you are a person worth being here and gettin thru ur shit. what seems obvious to me as a fallacy is to another a strength, i think that in recent political times facts and opinions have gotten confused for each other, and overwhelmingly what i care about is that people have chances to grow and learn, have community and resources, and to help one another alleviate our collective suffering. the government exists in direct opposition to this as a means of control, progressively in the world theatre as we approach fascism at an alarming rate. the government is inherently oppressive, and i find that no matter what flavor of politics someone believes we tend to have in common the understanding that power and control and greed are not good when millions of populace is at ur will.
Quote from: tristan_geoff on Apr 14, 2025, 07:23 PMi think progressively different points have been made, i dont see a reason to quell discussion happening naturally on solely my account. trust me i've been reading lol, i agree with most of the points said by trollheart and guybrush.
i feel that anger is an important emotion to learn what is important to you, but pushed in an unprocessed form onto people only muddles whatever point is trying to come forth.
that being said, i appreciate that there are people here on very different ends of the political spectrum, i think that no matter what you think you are a person worth being here and gettin thru ur shit. what seems obvious to me as a fallacy is to another a strength, i think that in recent political times facts and opinions have gotten confused for each other, and overwhelmingly what i care about is that people have chances to grow and learn, have community and resources, and to help one another alleviate our collective suffering. the government exists in direct opposition to this as a means of control, progressively in the world theatre as we approach fascism at an alarming rate. the government is inherently oppressive, and i find that no matter what flavor of politics someone believes we tend to have in common the understanding that power and control and greed are not good when millions of populace is at ur will.
That is a succint message, tristan. I was going to bold some of your post but then I thought all of it deserved to be emboldended.
i dont like tapping into threads like this but like
@Lexi Darling mentioned, it's my thread.
i did think JJ came off a bit not vibish,(no offense mate), because I agree
@tristan_geoff should be able to express their opinion on online forums, especially if it relates to them personally
Quote from: Guybrush on Apr 14, 2025, 06:17 AMI consider myself left and largely stay out of these discussions because I find them frustrating, but I still think we have to find the right balance so this place hopefully doesn't become just another echo chamber on the internet. The diversity of our community is part what makes us special, I think. Being able to connect across these differences is a beautiful thing. To preserve this, we gotta be a little careful that we don't cater to one side of an issue, but rather to principles that apply to all equally.
Just wanted to add a thought into this (and then let this discussion go). Recognizing both (or rather all) sides of an issue also needs people to critically examine and recognize when others are engaging in bad faith. While it's of course fine for people to speak their piece, not all sides and views are equally valid and you can't reason people out of an idea they didn't reason themselves into in the first place. A lot of bad faith arguments count on eliciting a reaction, not contributing to an actual discussion. Handle that as you (royal you here, not you guybrush lol) will, but it's usually a fool's game to grant those arguments and people your time and energy. You'll end up frustrated and derailed from any productive discussion that was going on, which you probably don't want. But, it's exactly what they want... an audience and a reaction. No matter how sharp your wit is, no matter how informed you are, and no matter how thoroughly you debunk a bad faith argument... you can never win, because there's always an illogical and fallacious way to flip the tables back around and keep getting you reacting and you ultimately take the L for dignifying it in the first place.
There's an odd unspoken standard online where there's some noble obligation to entertain ideas and people you would otherwise roll your eyes at and walk away from in real life. As if the angry drunk who walks around the bar picking shit with everyone should be treated as some erudite intellectual who is just a bit rough around the edges or is just telling "hard truths". IMO, while this has been a good thing in some cases because you can get exposed to interesting and valuable challenges to your ideas and views that you may not get offline, it's also been co-opted as a means to elevate some truly awful illogical shit and inject it into mainstream discourse which has manifested in real world harm. Either way, I've found my experience in online discussions infinitely better, more genuinely intellectually challenging and rewarding, and more fun when I started applying my real life standards to online interactions.
https://scd.community/index.php?topic=1705.msg44997#msg44997
Fuck this deranged eugenicist shithead. (https://www.motherjones.com/politics/2025/04/robert-kennedy-jr-autism-rates-press-conference-cdc-hhs-vaccines/)
He's putting autistic people on a government list. (https://bsky.app/profile/mattortega.com/post/3lnedau4f2f2j)
This is fucking terrifying. Absolute eugenicist psycho shit.
Quote from: Lexi Darling on Apr 22, 2025, 02:53 AMHe's putting autistic people on a government list. (https://bsky.app/profile/mattortega.com/post/3lnedau4f2f2j)
This is fucking terrifying. Absolute eugenicist psycho shit.
There are government run registries like this which external researchers can access for studies around Europe, with particularly large and detailed registries in Nordic nations... but this is not
at all like those (though I anticipate they will try to claim it is). No transparency for how and whose data will be extracted, no protocol for how it will be anonymized or stored, no apparent mechanisms for people to find out if they are included and opt out/have their data completely removed, and bizarrely these external researchers can only
view the data... so who does the analyses? Where does the data on whatever "toxins" he hopes to associate with autism come from, when/how was that collected? How will that be linked to the individuals in the study? All with a delusional goal of solving autism by September, especially given that they've purged nearly half of the NIH?
This is so
profoundly unethical and unscientifically nonsensical. Also, as someone who was in Sweden during the first couple years of the pandemic, even having fucking Bhattacharya anywhere near this makes my eye twitch.
(https://i.ibb.co/LWp9thq/c0546ca9-0753-49e2-86b4-f61b18f2016f.jpg)
Go OFF king